2012 : The Return of Quetzalcoatl [Archive] - Page 2

wallace

12-04-2006, 05:03 AM

[QUOTE=daniel;24105]Wallace,

Thanks for posting those articles. I do agree that consciousness is the central issue.

All of our technology manifests from a particular frequency of consciousness. If we change that frequency, the technology we create will also change.

Also it is interesting, giving the discussion above, where the two writers do leave a crucial space for art-making: A new myth-making is required to turn the necessary paradigm shift into a story that people can share and enjoy. Stories can be absorbed on a feeling level into the human organism in a way that facts and explanations cannot be.

The main failure of The Inconvenient Truth was its failure as story, because it chose the political propaganda-ist mode of the "hero biopic" rather than the more authentic storyteller mode for its scaffolding.

I feel the success of my new book is due to its presentation of my personal story of initiation. One way to frame our current consciousness crisis is as a global crisis of initiation - when there is no threshold passage into wisdom, requiring experiential knowledge of non-ordinary states, you have a culture trapped in adolescence. Many people have been going through their private, personally structured initiatory processes, but this hasn't emerged into the public discourse (which is polarized between religious noise and secular materialist noise). Part of the initiatory process requires the "bearing witness" by the larger community. That is what people get to do when they read my book (or even read about my book in Rolling Stone). I am realizing it almost doesn't matter if the first tone that is transmitted is one of ridicule, as long as the essential concept of there being an initiatory process is somehow conveyed.

I agree with everything you write here. I am particularly interested in illness as initation. I hope to explore Santo Daime because of their interest in healing. My recent taking of psychedelics seems to hopefully helping here.

Some of your writing does remind me of the best early days of Rolling Stone magazine.

Academics need to follow your example. Academia can be a trap.

Chris Bache(whose book I have yet to read) talks about how a group learning experience can turn into a mini initiation.

The feminist idea of the personal is political is being recast by yourself and others.

There is a big problem of abstractness, which needs to be avoided. We need to make everything more sensous.

Sunny thoughts,
Wallace

nyk

12-04-2006, 07:04 AM

There is a big problem of abstractness, which needs to be avoided. We need to make everything more sensous.

Yes. Bingo. Pretend you are blind.

graffitirun

12-04-2006, 08:28 AM

...on the other hand, abstraction can be very sensuous, sense filled- as one has to complete the 'picture' or become part of it in order for its completion or continuation

nyk

12-04-2006, 09:24 AM

...on the other hand, abstraction can be very sensuous, sense filled- as one has to complete the 'picture' or become part of it in order for its completion or continuation

Conscious abstraction. That is an art. The problem that our civilization
has is one of unconscious abstraction. We have been moulded to fit
certain invisible psychological frameworks. Identity imprints. We are
so married to these structures that we cannot see them, nor see what
we have become. And what we think are individual choices are usually
just variations within the boundaries of a larger corral.

Karyn

12-04-2006, 10:09 AM

There is only one yes. That is obvious upon personal internal inspection -
honest inspection. So, there is this interesting application of intent
within the one...a kind of bend that is occuring. Because you are here
now I can talk about it a wee bit. If you are familiar with the kundalini
- the serpent pathway - which is also of course Quetzalcoatl, then you
know that it follows the vertical line (pillar) of the being, or rather our
bodies follow it. One of the greatest mistakes of the dogma of kundalini
however is the recycled error that the 7th seal/chakra is at the crown
and that the energy follows a straight line out of the top. That is rather
strange considering the association of kundalini with the cobra. The
cobra bends the pathway forward. The 7th is actually located in the
limbic system, and it is that bend - like a shepards staff - after emerging
out of the 4th (point zero)...that compromise between escape velocity
(shooting straight out the top) and collapse that creates our being,
that stablizes us in a coherent reality.

It is highly significant that we have our hands together at the chest. That
is point zero. Zero is 'that which can be divided no further'. Singularity.
It is apparent that Mary is camoflauge for an archetype much bigger
than the bible. My focus is in that '5th Kingdom'...I really cannot
sustain the 4th world any longer.

Yes, fortuitous that you mentioned the sun. I learned recently that a
photon generated in the center of the sun takes some 10 thousand
years to get from there to the surface - traveling at the speed of
light, so dense and convoluted is the mass that it must travel thru.
Yesterday while travelling I made a peculiar connection within myself
with the sun. There is that dense hind brain of ours that contains all
of our lives and particulars. We are trapped in a maze there. For
thousands of years, on our way from the core into awakening. Hence
the head of Q coming our of the flower. Q represents our birth into
the '5th Kingdom'.

Hi Nyk, Here is a picture of the Sixth and Seventh Seal/Chakras:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Illu_pituitary_pineal_glands.jpg
I see your cobra. My studies say that we are to transmute the body not escape it. The Sun is the ruler of the Fourth Seal. The Collecting or Collective Intelligence. "concentrates all modes of consciousness which have gone before and combines them together in a new form". -PFC.
-Since the Soul sits in the Fourth Seal, I take this to mean that when our Self Consciousness - is moved up from the 3rd Seal to the 4th Seal -the wisdom owned from all past experience is gathered together and expressed through the Self Consciousness of the heart center.
-This must be the way to the Fifth Kingdom. Consciousness needs to move up the first three levels first.
Love, Karyn

graffitirun

12-04-2006, 10:26 AM

we cannot see them, nor see what we have become.

from the Marhsall Mcluhan lecture Art as Survival in the Electric Age

"...and in picasso or any other abstract artist the technique is simply to pull out the visual connections. That's what abstract means. Abstractus. It means the pulling-out. You pull out something. What you pull out ...is the connection."

" the 'missing link' has prompted more participation and scientific endeavor than all the links that were ever made. It's like a detective story. It involves you more deeply..."

mcluhan quoting t.s. eliot on mark twain;

"...Twain, at least in Huckleberry Finn, reveals himself to be one of those great writers, of whom there are not a great many in literature, who have discovered a new way of writing, valid not only for themselves but for others. ...I should place him in this respect... as one of those rare writers who have brought their language up to date, and in so doing, 'purified the dialect of the tribe' ... there is in Twain, I think, a great unconcious depth which gives to Huckleberry Finn this symbolic value: a symbolism all the more powerful for being uncalculated and unconscious."

from the 1974 lecture Living at the Speed of Light

" Organized ignorance as a way of bypassing the problem of knowledge as confusion as block to discovery brings me to the subject of Sputnik and the laws of media. When sputnik went up... it put the planet inside a man-made environment for the first time. Sputnik transformed the planet into spaceship earth with a program problem. Ecology became the name of the game from the moment of sputnik. The planet became an art from and life will never be the same on this planet again. Nature ended and art took over. Ecology is art."

(though I dont agree that nature ended...)

sidecross

12-04-2006, 11:40 AM

from the Marhsall Mcluhan lecture Art as Survival in the Electric Age

"...and in picasso or any other abstract artist the technique is simply to pull out the visual connections. That's what abstract means. Abstractus. It means the pulling-out. You pull out something. What you pull out ...is the connection."

" the 'missing link' has prompted more participation and scientific endeavor than all the links that were ever made. It's like a detective story. It involves you more deeply..."

mcluhan quoting t.s. eliot on mark twain;

"...Twain, at least in Huckleberry Finn, reveals himself to be one of those great writers, of whom there are not a great many in literature, who have discovered a new way of writing, valid not only for themselves but for others. ...I should place him in this respect... as one of those rare writers who have brought their language up to date, and in so doing, 'purified the dialect of the tribe' ... there is in Twain, I think, a great unconcious depth which gives to Huckleberry Finn this symbolic value: a symbolism all the more powerful for being uncalculated and unconscious."

from the 1974 lecture Living at the Speed of Light

" Organized ignorance as a way of bypassing the problem of knowledge as confusion as block to discovery brings me to the subject of Sputnik and the laws of media. When sputnik went up... it put the planet inside a man-made environment for the first time. Sputnik transformed the planet into spaceship earth with a program problem. Ecology became the name of the game from the moment of sputnik. The planet became an art from and life will never be the same on this planet again. Nature ended and art took over. Ecology is art."

(though I dont agree that nature ended...)

Thank you for the wonderful quotes of Marshal McLuhan; he is a personal favorite.

For those who might not know The Mechanical Bride: Folklore of Industrial Man was re-released in 2002.

nyk

12-04-2006, 11:45 AM

I see your cobra. My studies say that we are to transmute the body not escape it. The Sun is the ruler of the Fourth Seal. The Collecting or Collective Intelligence. "concentrates all modes of consciousness which have gone before and combines them together in a new form". -PFC.
-Since the Soul sits in the Fourth Seal, I take this to mean that when our Self Consciousness - is moved up from the 3rd Seal to the 4th Seal -the wisdom owned from all past experience is gathered together and expressed through the Self Consciousness of the heart center.
-This must be the way to the FifthKingdom. Consciousness needs to move up the first three levels first.

I do not worry over these seven numbers much and do not really believe
they really indicate compartmentalizable entities. I believe that most
of the kundalini dogma is grossly simplified; linear and lacking dimension.
People are not simply just in their 1st, 2nd, 3rd seals. They are also
in their 7th, 6th, 5th in varying degrees of complexity. Something is
lacking in the advocation of ascension. I think of a tree. I have read
that the Mayans considered humans trees too. Trees have a trunk
with roots and a canopy. Yes the roots draw from the ground and
bring the elements upward. But the canopy also draws in light and
brings that down. The tree also feels thru its roots as well.

Here are some poor illustrations of the limbic system:

http://img386.imageshack.us/img386/7963/limbic3d2nk5.jpg

http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/6006/limbic3dmu5.jpg
These might help better with visualization, and will have to do
until I get around to executing proper illustrations myself.
It appears to me that the pineal resides on the bend of the
pathway as it arcs up and over.

Do you feel this limbic chamber/apparatus? I have a near
permanent torque at this point in my lower forehead - the
same place that you feel when you achieve flying in the
dream state. Do you know that feeling? Also, the bridge
of the nose as well as the brow. My term of the moment
is 'limbic chamber engorgement'. Upper teeth and roof
of the mouth have something going on too. It is in this
area and in the center of the chest that I feel the
most intensity in my body - all the time now. There is
often some process I have to go thru each day in
the vicinity of the solar plexus, but that is not a contin-
uous feature.

So here is a sheppard's staff:

http://img238.imageshack.us/img238/5079/shepar1tl7.jpg

Feel that?

daniel

12-04-2006, 04:26 PM

Could people stop quoting images? It is an unnecessary repetition.

nyk

12-04-2006, 05:08 PM

Karen - Don't let it bother you that Daniel's first response to you in this forum
was a reprimand. He has an infected tooth. ;)

Karyn

12-04-2006, 05:10 PM

Hi Nyk, I replied to your message using the Quote button and all the pictures showed up again. -When Daniel says stop he means me...not you.
Sorry Daniel.
I agree with you Nyk but I can tell the difference when consciousness has moved to the fourth level to stay compared to when it is a state of awareness that you move in and out of. I think even though our awareness is always moving in and out of the different levels that the Fourth should be the dominant one. I now mine is not yet because I do not have that feeling that everyone is a part of myself that I had a couple of Aprils ago. Another thing I noticed that is different now than that week in higher consciousness is that I am not in the Now like I was. I must still be missing a Key.
-There...the message even came out better this time. Love, Karyn

nyk

12-04-2006, 07:27 PM

Hi Nyk, I replied to your message using the Quote button and all the pictures showed up again. -When Daniel says stop he means me...not you.

That's why I said he was reprimanding you. When he reprimands me he
pretends I don't exist. I'm getting used to it. After you hit the quote
button, just trim out what you don't want from inside of it - you know,
drag your cursor with the left button down to highlight a section and
then hit ctrl-X.

I agree with you Nyk but I can tell the difference when consciousness has moved to the fourth level to stay compared to when it is a state of awareness that you move in and out of. I think even though our awareness is always moving in and out of the different levels that the Fourth should be the dominant one. I now mine is not yet because I do not have that feeling that everyone is a part of myself that I had a couple of Aprils ago. Another thing I noticed that is different now than that week in higher consciousness is that I am not in the Now like I was. I must still be missing a Key.
-There...the message even came out better this time. Love, Karyn

Fourth should always be dominant, yes. But beyond that is the relation-
ship between the 4th and the 7th. Think of the 4th like a seed.
The roots break out of the kernel and reach downward. One can get
very complex concerning the circuitry between 4 and 1, but the bottom
line is that section is like the roots of a plant...you want them to function
free and clear. Aye? From the top of the seed is the sprout which becomes
the above-ground portion of the plant. Think of a shoot that comes out
of 4 and reaches up and then makes a little curl at the end. That end
is the 7th. We also desire a free and clean pathway between the 4th
and 7th. But moreover, we want a particular alignment between the
two. The 4th is a singularity and the 7th is a singularity. There is some
particular affiliation between head and heart that is the balance between
pulling away and collapsing together. A doubling effect, for want of
better terminology. That energy configuration feels kind of like this (one of
my 'cards'):
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/7995/seahorsesmnt8.jpg

All of us have spectacular moments of unsurpassed alignments. And then
we find ourselves back in the thick of things that we would prefer to
have left behind. And we have to plow thru all of that. You could think
of your 'April' as a carrot that you have yourself cast forward to pull
the totality of what you are forward.

nyk

12-04-2006, 11:09 PM

I take illumination to mean one who has had the experience of ecstatic states and maintains a continued awareness that these states are of primary importance to soul and spirit.........

I wrote a lengthy response to everything you wrote yesterday and
even copied the whole thing to a word document before pressing
'Submit Reply'. Poof. All gone. That is just too weird. I'm going to bed.
:hmm:

sidecross

12-05-2006, 05:16 AM

Could people stop quoting images? It is an unnecessary repetition.

I am still using a modem and I agree with daniel on this issue.

Could we st up a part of BOTH that has to do with images and their responses?

This might solve some of the problem.

Karyn

12-05-2006, 06:14 AM

Fourth should always be dominant, yes. But beyond that is the relation-
ship between the 4th and the 7th. Think of the 4th like a seed.
The roots break out of the kernel and reach downward. One can get
very complex concerning the circuitry between 4 and 1, but the bottom
line is that section is like the roots of a plant...you want them to function
free and clear. Aye? From the top of the seed is the sprout which becomes
the above-ground portion of the plant. Think of a shoot that comes out
of 4 and reaches up and then makes a little curl at the end. That end
is the 7th. We also desire a free and clean pathway between the 4th
and 7th. But moreover, we want a particular alignment between the
two. The 4th is a singularity and the 7th is a singularity. There is some
particular affiliation between head and heart that is the balance between
pulling away and collapsing together. A doubling effect, for want of
better terminology. That energy configuration feels kind of like this (one of
my 'cards'):
All of us have spectacular moments of unsurpassed alignments. And then
we find ourselves back in the thick of things that we would prefer to
have left behind. And we have to plow thru all of that. You could think
of your 'April' as a carrot that you have yourself cast forward to pull
the totality of what you are forward.

Hi Nyk, Yes that is what I am doing. I am using that experience to see where I am at now.
I found some info on the 1st Seal that I think is very interesting.
There is supposed to be seven stages to that state of being. The Key that represents the completion of The Great Work, the final liberation is Key 21 The World- sometimes called The Universe. The dancing figure in this Key is Androgyne. Key 0 which represents our true Self and Superconsciousness is also Androgyne.
This final stage - Key 21 is Self Consciousness and Subconsciousness merged together with Superconsciousness. For some reason Paul places this is in the First Seal. The First seal represents this level- Hertzian- Physical. I take this to mean we complete The Great Work here. We change our consciousness here - change our bodies here. We will vibrate at a higher frequency. When I went to see Ramtha in New York he said that there is a higher level of Hertzian that we have not seen yet.
Love, Karyn

Karyn

12-05-2006, 06:24 AM

I am still using a modem and I agree with daniel on this issue.

Could we st up a part of BOTH that has to do with images and their responses?

This might solve some of the problem.

Hi Sidecross, I was the problem and Daniel corrected me. I did not know how to delete the images until Nyk told me how to use Ctrl-x.

Love, Karyn

nyk

12-05-2006, 07:57 AM

Hi Nyk, Yes that is what I am doing. I am using that experience to see where I am at now.
I found some info on the 1st Seal that I think is very interesting.
There is supposed to be seven stages to that state of being. The Key that represents the completion of The Great Work, the final liberation is Key 21 The World- sometimes called The Universe. The dancing figure in this Key is Androgyne. Key 0 which represents our true Self and Superconsciousness is also Androgyne.
This final stage - Key 21 is Self Consciousness and Subconsciousness merged together with Superconsciousness. For some reason Paul places this is in the First Seal. The First seal represents this level- Hertzian- Physical. I take this to mean we complete The Great Work here. We change our consciousness here - change our bodies here. We will vibrate at a higher frequency. When I went to see Ramtha in New York he said that there is a higher level of Hertzian that we have not seen yet.
Love, Karyn

Yes, we cannot come to totality in space or as ghosts. This is why I
have stripped away most of the kundalini doctrine as superfluous. In
my notes I have a large circle the top of which is at the bottom of
the throat and the bottom of which meets the bottom of the sternum.
A smaller circle is at the brow/nasal area. Also circled are the hands
and the feet. I had the weirdest things going on in the feet and
ankles for several years until this year. I'd call a given moment KF -
kundalini foot, for short. Got to be a joke. Now my feet are like
fuzzy magnetic fields. Much better. Our hands and feet are living
symbols of contact with physical reality. Thought meets matter.
Very important. We are here to make intimate contact. Yeah, we
are the 'aliens'. But I think we already know that, don't we?

And yes the androgyne - that is absolutely key to this entire
actualization. When the hands come together at the sternum
male and female merge together. That is the solution and
the passageway to completion. There is but a single thought
which holds that apart, though it may seem very complex up
until that point.

nyk

12-05-2006, 07:58 AM

I am still using a modem and I agree with daniel on this issue.

Could we st up a part of BOTH that has to do with images and their responses?

This might solve some of the problem.

Images are integral to my expression. I won't be relegated to some
back 'art' corner.

sidecross

12-05-2006, 08:41 AM

Images are integral to my expression. I won't be relegated to some
back 'art' corner.

As a former photrapher myself I was not inferring to "relegated to some back 'art' corner"; I was thinking of have a section of this forum for art work.

I am on a fixed income and can not or do not want to add another expense to view graphics or video on my computer which I use for writing & reading.

My suggestion was meant to be accommodating to both and not meant as a slight to photographs or high megabyte viewing.

nanouk

12-05-2006, 09:02 AM

I have read, and read again, the Bache and AtKisson articles, and still find myself in doubt whether anyone still sleeping will actually wake up?

I agree with absolutely everything said, and the ideology and answers to a true global collective are there, but we all, (except for the lucky, self sufficient and illuminated Hermit) are surrounded by what i (regretably)cynically call "Grazers".

Like Billy goats greedily chomping away at everything they can,'til their bellies pop.

And this is while the shepherd is frantically trying to pull the grazer into a safe pen for the night because the wolves are howling nearby...completely ignorant of doom looming...either because they don't care, or because they don't have the mental capacity to care...or simply because they are greedy.

I am not one to take to New Ageism, more inclined to open myself to understand Eastern Mysticism and Hermeticism, together with what i have learned from Mother Nature Herself (I Bow to Her), but if there is One thing i have started to believe in more and more lately, as Spiritual Saviours and Warriors, is The Indigo Children, descendants of the Rainbow itself.

It is them, i believe, who will finally gather Us/the One together and give the "Grazers" no choice.

I am afraid i feel like just the neanderthal nyk mentioned, because the words just aren't there, there are no words for the effort and energy it takes to keep the Light and Love flowing outwards(mostly i have to wear a hat to cover it!*lol*)

It just has to flow without questioning or analyzing...
(...as widely as me as an individual and part of the collective in my community can make it...)
...but "knowing" the Light gives Strength, and Strength is sufficient nourishment for now...

Peace, Love and Respect,

~n~(combing my aura again):o

Karyn

12-05-2006, 09:13 AM

Yes, we cannot come to totality in space or as ghosts. This is why I
have stripped away most of the kundalini doctrine as superfluous. In
my notes I have a large circle the top of which is at the bottom of
the throat and the bottom of which meets the bottom of the sternum.
A smaller circle is at the brow/nasal area. Also circled are the hands
and the feet. I had the weirdest things going on in the feet and
ankles for several years until this year. I'd call a given moment KF -
kundalini foot, for short. Got to be a joke. Now my feet are like
fuzzy magnetic fields. Much better. Our hands and feet are living
symbols of contact with physical reality. Thought meets matter.
Very important. We are here to make intimate contact. Yeah, we
are the 'aliens'. But I think we already know that, don't we?

And yes the androgyne - that is absolutely key to this entire
actualization. When the hands come together at the sternum
male and female merge together. That is the solution and
the passageway to completion. There is but a single thought
which holds that apart, though it may seem very complex up
until that point.

Dear Nyk,
I am so impressed with you! You have put the pieces of the puzzle together.

About aliens... I have a past life as Reptilian. I was shown in a vision that we may incarnate as Reptilian- but we are still human. And the Beings we have communicated with during our circle meetings all speak and understand human thought. Even the maleovolent ones. I just read that all of nature has consciousness--human consciousness. Animals and plants included. This makes sense to me because I have had a few short conversations with my dog and she answers me with human thoughts and words. At first I thought my mind was tricking me but then there is that mystery school teaching to trust your own experience above all else. I just got the thought that I should talk to my plants because they do understand. -No wonder my grandmother's plants did so well even though she over watered every one! She really cared about them and spoke to them like they were human.
Love, Karyn

magicbean

12-05-2006, 09:14 AM

My suggestion was meant to be accommodating to both and not meant as a slight to photographs or high megabyte viewing.

Nyk, be a better negotiator. Sidecross is right. Pictures can be a pain to download for those on slow access routes, but they certainly are a welcome way of communicating. And duplicates of pictures are needless. There's certainly a way to accommodate those who love posting pictures with those who have to work around it. I have a tiny monitor and big images really make it hard to navigate. How about shrinking the image size down to make it easier to download and viewable for those of us with limited viewspace?

Now back to reading the more substantive stuff...

nyk

12-05-2006, 09:16 AM

I have read, and read again, the Bache and AtKisson articles, and still find myself in doubt whether anyone still sleeping will actually wake up?

I suggest we don't wait any longer. Just do what needs to be done -
ourselves. It is because of mass grazing consciousness that we have
compromised our vision and our action.

~n~(combing my aura again):o

Oh yeah - combing. That is one of the best allegories around...combing,
grooming....

nyk

12-05-2006, 09:25 AM

Nyk, be a better negotiator. Sidecross is right. Pictures can be a pain to download for those on slow access routes, but they certainly are a welcome way of communicating. And duplicates of pictures are needless. There's certainly a way to accommodate those who love posting pictures with those who have to work around it. I have a tiny monitor and big images really make it hard to navigate. How about shrinking the image size down to make it easier to download and viewable for those of us with limited viewspace?

That picture of mary and the volcanoe goes hand-in-hand with every
posting I have made. There is a vital reason for posting that and for
it grabbing your frontal lobe. Sidecross has his reasons for reading
and posting what he does and the way he does it and so do I. Words
are cheap at this point - in my opinion - there lingers still an enormous
disconnect between ideation and living reality. If Daniel wants to set
aside a separate section for visuals, then I will restrict all of my postings
to that area. I already shrank my own images down from 50 to 25 percent
before placing them here.

nyk

12-05-2006, 09:31 AM

I just read that all of nature has consciousness--human consciousness. Animals and plants included.

Everything is consciousness. The whole seething mass of reality.

My nickname for us, as humans, is 'the herniated void'. The purpose
for our twisted and unique inclination is the development of a certain
quality of acute consciousness. That comes with a hefty price tag
in terms of disassociation from large portions of living reality...for a
time.

willoweyes

12-05-2006, 09:33 AM

Dear NYK and Nanouk, thank you for these lovely posts. I appreciate. . .isn't that worth something?

The Indigo children yes. Read the Road.

nanouk

12-05-2006, 09:44 AM

I suggest we don't wait any longer. Just do what needs to be done -
ourselves. It is because of mass grazing consciousness that we have
compromised our vision and our action.

Well, that was my point when i compared the Billy Goat with the masses, one has to gather Strength to emminate[sp?] the Light by being one's own Shepherd. ;)

And, admittedly, my getting married was my defeat into the Black Mass Grazing Hole :evil: , it was with regret i had to leave my partner behind a few years ago, but my health is 200% better!

So is my Faith... :D

~N~

nanouk

12-05-2006, 09:48 AM

Dear NYK and Nanouk, thank you for these lovely posts. I appreciate. . .isn't that worth something?

The Indigo children yes. Read the Road.

Namaste, Willoweyes. I have read everyone's reviews of "The Road" and have asked Santa very nicely! ;)

nyk

12-05-2006, 09:55 AM

Dear NYK and Nanouk, thank you for these lovely posts. I appreciate. . .isn't that worth something?

The Indigo children yes. Read the Road.

Your appreciation is worth a lot - to me.

nyk

12-05-2006, 10:02 AM

Well, that was my point when i compared the Billy Goat with the masses, one has to gather Strength to emminate[sp?] the Light by being one's own Shepherd. ;)

And, admittedly, my getting married was my defeat into the Black Mass Grazing Hole :evil: , it was with regret i had to leave my partner behind a few years ago, but my health is 200% better!

So is my Faith... :D

~N~

I think we all make the descent into the black mass. I think we have to.
I can stand and cast my sight back over my previous decades of adult
life and see little more than a yawning void. I mean, so much of that
is so stupid and so lacking in obvious ways. My neandertal period - ha!
Maybe we can see the black mass in terms of earth. A seed in the
earth. We had to get down and dirty to get real.

Damien

12-05-2006, 12:05 PM

Isaiah Mpski

12-05-2006, 12:51 PM

Yes Yes.All hail California.

sidecross

12-05-2006, 01:11 PM

First, nyk, let me say I still consider myself a visual artist; I just no longer leave behind artifacts. Like Robert Frank, I have fulfilled my need to produce further images.

Anyone who has been on BOTH for any length of time and have read my posts will have seen, that in terms of word count, my posts are on the light side.

Isaiah Mpski

12-05-2006, 01:28 PM

Yes,but the shit you tack onto it is filling up somebody's time.
You never did answer my question.
Are you capable of answering a civil question Arteimus?
Almost had you guys fooled didn't i?

nyk

12-05-2006, 01:37 PM

First, nyk, let me say I still consider myself a visual artist; I just no longer leave behind artifacts. Like Robert Frank, I have fulfilled my need to produce further images.

I assumed so. I stopped seven years ago. And this year I began all
over again. And I will probably stop again in the near future and shift
to wood working.

Different frogs in the same pond.

sidecross

12-05-2006, 02:04 PM

I assumed so. I stopped seven years ago. And this year I began all
over again. And I will probably stop again in the near future and shift
to wood working.

Different frogs in the same pond.

Yes, we are the frogs in the pond.

This is an exciting time to be a photographer; If I were able and had the interest I would still be using film and then scanning images into a computer.

I was quite good in the darkroom, but I never liked that work. Using film, I would not even mind developing it myself, I would then complete the work digitally with an Apple computer and Photshop.

nyk

12-05-2006, 05:16 PM

This is an exciting time to be a photographer; If I were able and had the interest I would still be using film and then scanning images into a computer.

I was quite good in the darkroom, but I never liked that work. Using film, I would not even mind developing it myself, I would then complete the work digitally with an Apple computer and Photshop.

I could never understand how anyone could not be obsessed with some
form of artistic endeavor. I am in recapitulation/resolution mode right
now, having rekindled my arts and music. I am running all of that thru
what I am now and finding out what is really me and what is artifice. I
keep digital to a minimum. My multi-track is pure vintage analog. I play
a backpacker acoustic guitar most of the time. Wood. I love wood. Have
always loved trees. I have taken one photograph this month (Mary
and the Volcano); six months ago I would've taken a hundred by now.

Hey look - no images on this entire page of the thread!

nyk

12-05-2006, 05:30 PM

...Funny although it is written clearly in black and white many students of the same school seem unable to see these teachings. I have even pointed out the lesson number - page and paragraph- but they seem to have a mental block in this area....

It is this way all over. I noticed it after that little adventure in yellowstone.
And in the past several years I have poked around and found it is true
everywhere. Not only that, it appears to be getting more and more so.
Something very strange is going on. I think Daniel senses it too as he
referenced a key aspect of Gurdjieff which relates to this phenomena.
Where it is all leading I haven't a clue. But one thing I do know - I
am only going to intensify this process that I have 'discovered' and
drive it all of the way thru. The heat is on.

Damien

12-05-2006, 08:39 PM

It is this way all over. I noticed it after that little adventure in yellowstone.
And in the past several years I have poked around and found it is true
everywhere. Not only that, it appears to be getting more and more so.
Something very strange is going on. I think Daniel senses it too as he
referenced a key aspect of Gurdjieff which relates to this phenomena.
Where it is all leading I haven't a clue. But one thing I do know - I
am only going to intensify this process that I have 'discovered' and
drive it all of the way thru. The heat is on.

I honestly have driven myself off track. I've been basically waiting for people to come together, for there to be some kind of fomented movement towards revolution, this hasn't propagated itself. The outliers of individualism have marketed themselves out of bounds. Chaos and dispruption are the orders of the day. There is a seeming gaffe between what is possible and what is probable, probably being a descended crescendo towards a dark bloody hell. On the other hand, if there is a shed glimmer of hope percolating around the goal, then the actuality of the future is asserted.

but i can't give anymore than I am given. there is definitely no way in which i can combine myself with those who aren't ready to move. individualism cancered towards deemed solipsism. so what's the plan stan.

nyk

12-05-2006, 11:12 PM

I honestly have driven myself off track...so what's
the plan stan.

A few quantum singularities spread across the globe, slowly going nova?

I sincerely doubt that the herd is ever going to be a conscious participant
in this evolution. They wouldn't want to be. And I don't think it matters.

Consciousness has the potential to be extremely powerful - externally.
I've experienced this quite a few times, and while I cannot say I have
ever had any specific control over it, I do know that it has always been
associated with a certain kind of consolidated intentionality; focus of
being. I am convinced that our failure to lucid action is a result of
diluted intent...consciousness dispersed thru psychological conditioning.
It is a matter of bringing the full force of consciousness into direct
alignment with perception and touch. There's no mumbo-jumbo to that.
The less mumbo-jumbo the better. The less structured thought the
better. Just a firm, quiet conviction that is singular - all facets of
one's being in phase and directed in concert.

If only we weren't so easily distracted...

Isaiah Mpski

12-06-2006, 04:02 AM

Git up.Go to work.Go to bed.
Fuck all the other frogs.

Karyn

12-06-2006, 06:11 AM

It is a matter of bringing the full force of consciousness into direct
alignment with perception and touch. There's no mumbo-jumbo to that.
The less mumbo-jumbo the better. The less structured thought the
better. Just a firm, quiet conviction that is singular - all facets of
one's being in phase and directed in concert.

If only we weren't so easily distracted...

Hi Nyk, That is what I call living in the Now. I remember how it was. I was only taking direction from my inner Holy Spirit which I knew to look for in the 4th Seal. My attention was only in the present moment appreciating every second because I Knew my God was creating it for me to see or experince something. How to hold the focus? My guess is that it is a self sustaining focus after we have cleared all issues from our emotional body-personality. Our perception- Self Conscious awareness does increase naturaly when emotional issues are removed.
Love, Karyn

Isaiah Mpski

12-06-2006, 06:42 AM

I've been dreaming alot lately about frogs Daniel.
Does anyone see how important it is for Daniel that we acquire him a piecec of land in Aztec country?

nyk

12-06-2006, 08:09 AM

Hi Nyk, That is what I call living in the Now. I remember how it was. I was only taking direction from my inner Holy Spirit which I knew to look for in the 4th Seal. My attention was only in the present moment appreciating every second because I Knew my God was creating it for me to see or experince something. How to hold the focus? My guess is that it is a self sustaining focus after we have cleared all issues from our emotional body-personality. Our perception- Self Conscious awareness does increase naturaly when emotional issues are removed.
Love, Karyn

Let's take this apart a little. What is happening when one is not living
in the Now? Your mind has drifted, yes? You drove several miles and
didn't even see the road. It's a mind issue isn't it? The mind goes astray.
Astray from what? Physicality. Your mind kind of floats up and leaks
out. Bring it down. Bend it down into that crook/cobra I illustrated
and feel that resonance in the brow and behind the bridge of the
nose. Feel it physically. Feel the limbic. A concept is no good unless
you can enter inside of it and feel it. Spread your arms a little then
sweep them together and upward at the same time to conjoin palm-to-
palm at the sternum. Do that physically. Exhale thickly and fully as
you do that. Wham - Point Zero. There it is; there you are. It is very
Now. Notice also that it is physical too. You have just taken all of
your first three seal issues - including gender polarization - and
collapsed them into Point Zero, the Source, the Soul. The center of
the torus. I hold it there in singularity, in stillness, for a sustained
moment. Then I breath in once, and along with the next exhalation
continue the arms up and out - the fountain, the canopy of the tree.
I do this outside facing the dawn very first thing when I get up
in the morning, before I do anything else. It is also the very last thing
that I do before sliding into bed each night. It is so simple that it is
easy to be completely in the Now while doing it. I realized the signific-
ance of that gesture/salutation eight years ago. There is a lot of
brain candy in it. But it has only been since September of this year
that I have actually made it a practice; physical, real, consistent. And
like I said earlier, I feel my sternum and limbic all of the time now.
We have to train ourselves. It requires a fair degree of discipline and
persistence. Keep finding ways of bending your mind down, and then
bringing it thru the physical - from the 4th Seal outward into life.

Karyn

12-06-2006, 09:00 AM

Let's take this apart a little. What is happening when one is not living
in the Now? Your mind has drifted, yes? You drove several miles and
didn't even see the road. It's a mind issue isn't it? The mind goes astray.
Astray from what? Physicality. Your mind kind of floats up and leaks
out. Bring it down. Bend it down into that crook/cobra I illustrated
and feel that resonance in the brow and behind the bridge of the
nose. Feel it physically. Feel the limbic. A concept is no good unless
you can enter inside of it and feel it. Spread your arms a little then
sweep them together and upward at the same time to conjoin palm-to-
palm at the sternum. Do that physically. Exhale thickly and fully as
you do that. Wham - Point Zero. There it is; there you are. It is very
Now. Notice also that it is physical too. You have just taken all of
your first three seal issues - including gender polarization - and
collapsed them into Point Zero, the Source, the Soul. The center of
the torus. I hold it there in singularity, in stillness, for a sustained
moment. Then I breath in once, and along with the next exhalation
continue the arms up and out - the fountain, the canopy of the tree.
I do this outside facing the dawn very first thing when I get up
in the morning, before I do anything else. It is also the very last thing
that I do before sliding into bed each night. It is so simple that it is
easy to be completely in the Now while doing it. I realized the signific-
ance of that gesture/salutation eight years ago. There is a lot of
brain candy in it. But it has only been since September of this year
that I have actually made it a practice; physical, real, consistent. And
like I said earlier, I feel my sternum and limbic all of the time now.
We have to train ourselves. It requires a fair degree of discipline and
persistence. Keep finding ways of bending your mind down, and then
bringing it thru the physical - from the 4th Seal outward into life.

Oh that's right. I forgot how important the physical demonstration is to show my intent to the Subconscious. I will copy you. Thank you Nyk. Love, Karyn

nanouk

12-06-2006, 09:37 AM

We are not afraid of war or battle and will see to its end whatever means necessary to change this planet for the better. The Ascension must come through.

Without a doubt it is important to stretch one's brain and fill it with meta-physical platitudes and scientific back bone to one's theories on Life, The Universe, and Everything, but science, pseudo science and quantum theories do not equal empathic existence.

Stephen Hawking is one of the exceptions, perhaps through his physical condition, but i believe he "ascended" to a higher plane before he even found a way to communicate verbally. He knows how to close his eyes and "see" Star Births, "feel" the Solar Winds, and "hear" the Black Holes.

I think you know what i mean, Damien... ;)

Love and Respect,

~n~

daniel

12-06-2006, 09:56 AM

nyk

12-06-2006, 10:07 AM

Oh that's right. I forgot how important the physical demonstration is to show my intent to the Subconscious. I will copy you. Thank you Nyk. Love, Karyn

Yes...so important to bringing your spirit all of the way thru into life. We
are to be conduits for the life force of the universe. That is thru our
psychologies and our physicalities. All we have to do is ascertain that
our consciousness is wed to our immediate scene - body and environment.
Your thinking - whatever it is comprised of - and your awareness is
conjoined with your breath and your eyes and your fingers and toes.
Your moment-to-moment existence becomes a conscious dance. Every
moment. Our lack of continuity is our biggest problem. We easily break
off and splinter. This is as difficult as becoming lucid in the dream state
and carrying that condition along further into the night. We have to
get pretty creative with this process to keep it alive and conscious.
Roleplaying may be the answer to that.

nyk

12-06-2006, 10:20 AM

The shift occurs when the locus of consciousness moves from the individual ego to the higher awareness and presence of the "higher self" or oversoul which identifies with the earth and the human collective rather than its own goals or concepts.

Could you be more specific concerning this movement of the locus
of consciousness - in practical terms?

Damien

12-06-2006, 10:30 AM

Hi Damien, Nanouk, et al,

Great posts!

I had a profound presentiment how the "quantum shift" occurs at Burning Man a couple of years ago, when I made an attempt to foment a Black Rock rebellion after learning about the New Orleans debacle on Friday, the night before the Man burns.

The shift occurs when the locus of consciousness moves from the individual ego to the higher awareness and presence of the "higher self" or oversoul which identifies with the earth and the human collective rather than its own goals or concepts. When this other level comes through, individual awareness is still present, but all activities are oriented differently, around the giving of one's self totally and completely to the necessity of the situation. In such a mind-state, there is no such thing as personal property, no "mine" or "yours." There is no confusion over hierarchies or hurt feelings over wounds to the ego - a "natural hierarchy" spontaneously emerges, where it becomes transparently clear who is meant for what role - whose karmic pattern and skillset matches with the particular task that needs to be performed for the good of the collective.

This is what I believe Christopher Bache foresaw in his vision of the crisis, breakdown, and breakthrough - coming soon to a reality theater near you!

Aye, within the movement we have warriors, those who will fight for the change...the caretakers, those who will nurse those wounded. the information collectors whose job it is to gather esoteric spiritual information and disseminate it to the masses. Indigos all.

Damien

12-06-2006, 10:31 AM

Yes...so important to bringing your spirit all of the way thru into life. We
are to be conduits for the life force of the universe. That is thru our
psychologies and our physicalities. All we have to do is ascertain that
our consciousness is wed to our immediate scene - body and environment.
Your thinking - whatever it is comprised of - and your awareness is
conjoined with your breath and your eyes and your fingers and toes.
Your moment-to-moment existence becomes a conscious dance. Every
moment. Our lack of continuity is our biggest problem. We easily break
off and splinter. This is as difficult as becoming lucid in the dream state
and carrying that condition along further into the night. We have to
get pretty creative with this process to keep it alive and conscious.
Roleplaying may be the answer to that.

we must come together...in terms of our felt-sense. the groups will father movement.

Damien

12-06-2006, 10:37 AM

Could you be more specific concerning this movement of the locus
of consciousness - in practical terms?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rRAhCCGb7BY

Damien

12-06-2006, 10:40 AM

http://youtube.com/watch?v=SZwyiy90X2I

nanouk

12-06-2006, 10:43 AM

Hi Damien, Nanouk, et al,

Great posts!

I had a profound presentiment how the "quantum shift" occurs at Burning Man a couple of years ago, when I made an attempt to foment a Black Rock rebellion after learning about the New Orleans debacle on Friday, the night before the Man burns.

The shift occurs when the locus of consciousness moves from the individual ego to the higher awareness and presence of the "higher self" or oversoul which identifies with the earth and the human collective rather than its own goals or concepts. When this other level comes through, individual awareness is still present, but all activities are oriented differently, around the giving of one's self totally and completely to the necessity of the situation. In such a mind-state, there is no such thing as personal property, no "mine" or "yours." There is no confusion over hierarchies or hurt feelings over wounds to the ego - a "natural hierarchy" spontaneously emerges, where it becomes transparently clear who is meant for what role - whose karmic pattern and skillset matches with the particular task that needs to be performed for the good of the collective.

This is what I believe Christopher Bache foresaw in his vision of the crisis, breakdown, and breakthrough - coming soon to a reality theater near you!

Thank You for acknowledging my thoughts, Daniel, nice to speak with you, finally!

That non-materialistic mind state has been a very easy thing for me personally to maintain, i like living light ;) and i totally agree with you how you define "natural hierarchy", we all have different purposes here in this lifetime, and published authors like yourself, hey! you guys are eternalized in other's lifetimes too! :cool:

...unless your books get burned in some fascist mass hysterical act in the future, who knows? *shudder* (lets not even materialize such a thought...black magick)

i will start dusting off the red velvet stage curtains immediately, cheers! ;)

Love and Respect,
~n~

nanouk

12-06-2006, 11:03 AM

Our lack of continuity is our biggest problem. We easily break
off and splinter. This is as difficult as becoming lucid in the dream state
and carrying that condition along further into the night. We have to
get pretty creative with this process to keep it alive and conscious.
Roleplaying may be the answer to that.

I was a vivid sleep-talker all through my childhood, until my early to mid-twenties, and then it suddenly stopped. It started again last week. I keep waking up by conversing with myself, at least half a dozen times every night, continuing into day break! *lol*

...and it is all about passing little trees on the crossroads, deciding which pebble to take home from the beach or which sandwich to choose from the tray offered...weird stuff...or very trivial...

...in any case, anyone else started sleep-talking also lately?

Love and Respect,
~n~

nanouk

12-06-2006, 11:19 AM

http://youtube.com/watch?v=rRAhCCGb7BY

Dear Damien, i am a registered user at YouTube, but every link that has been posted here, by you today, or anyone else in the past, comes up in HTML or some other code...any chance you could post the titles of these clips, so i can go into the website and search for myself?

Cheers! :)

~N~

nyk

12-06-2006, 11:23 AM

Nyk: Yes...so important to bringing your spirit all of the way thru into life. We
are to be conduits for the life force of the universe. That is thru our
psychologies and our physicalities. All we have to do is ascertain that
our consciousness is wed to our immediate scene - body and environment.
Your thinking - whatever it is comprised of - and your awareness is
conjoined with your breath and your eyes and your fingers and toes.
Your moment-to-moment existence becomes a conscious dance. Every
moment. Our lack of continuity is our biggest problem. We easily break
off and splinter. This is as difficult as becoming lucid in the dream state
and carrying that condition along further into the night. We have to
get pretty creative with this process to keep it alive and conscious.
Roleplaying may be the answer to that.

Damien: we must come together...in terms of our felt-sense.
the groups will father movement.

It isn't going to do any good coming together if the individuals of the
group are not already fully self-aware on their own. This is an old
pipe dream.

nyk

12-06-2006, 11:26 AM

Let's take this apart a little. What is happening when one is not living
in the Now? Your mind has drifted, yes? You drove several miles and
didn't even see the road. It's a mind issue isn't it? The mind goes astray.
Astray from what? Physicality. Your mind kind of floats up and leaks
out. Bring it down. Bend it down into that crook/cobra I illustrated
and feel that resonance in the brow and behind the bridge of the
nose. Feel it physically. Feel the limbic. A concept is no good unless
you can enter inside of it and feel it. Spread your arms a little then
sweep them together and upward at the same time to conjoin palm-to-
palm at the sternum. Do that physically. Exhale thickly and fully as
you do that. Wham - Point Zero. There it is; there you are. It is very
Now. Notice also that it is physical too. You have just taken all of
your first three seal issues - including gender polarization - and
collapsed them into Point Zero, the Source, the Soul. The center of
the torus. I hold it there in singularity, in stillness, for a sustained
moment. Then I breath in once, and along with the next exhalation
continue the arms up and out - the fountain, the canopy of the tree.
I do this outside facing the dawn very first thing when I get up
in the morning, before I do anything else. It is also the very last thing
that I do before sliding into bed each night. It is so simple that it is
easy to be completely in the Now while doing it. I realized the signific-
ance of that gesture/salutation eight years ago. There is a lot of
brain candy in it. But it has only been since September of this year
that I have actually made it a practice; physical, real, consistent. And
like I said earlier, I feel my sternum and limbic all of the time now.
We have to train ourselves. It requires a fair degree of discipline and
persistence. Keep finding ways of bending your mind down, and then
bringing it thru the physical - from the 4th Seal outward into life.

Out of curiosity...how many read this post of mine on the previous page,
and of those who did, how many actually took the idea and tried it
physically - for real?

daniel

12-06-2006, 11:27 AM

I shouldn't give it a spatial identifier as in "higher" - lets say a more immanent level of consciousness. One help is the division that Gurdjieff makes between "essence" and "personality." Essence is the basic form of individuated awareness before it has been socially conditioned - personality is the deformations of essence caused by social conditioning. When children are very little, they do not identify themselves as "I" - my daughter called herself by her name for the first year of language development, before beginning to see herself as "I". In other words, "I" awareness is in itself a product of social conditioning.

Humans socialized in tribal groups are more aware of themselves as having a collective identity and less involved with their personal identity. There is a story of a documentary filmmaker who wanted to film a tribe of Australian Aboriginals. The filmmaker showed them a number of films and asked how they wanted to be represented. They said they preferred a wide-angle format because they wanted the entire tribe to be present in every shot, with no close-ups on any individual at all. That is how the film was made - I have seen it.

The step forward for us as a species is simultaneously remaining in the individual ego-identity we developed over the last 1000s of years, but, through what Gebser calls "ego freedom," having that deeper awareness of our inseparability from the species mind and planet mind (or noosphere), so that all our actions naturally unfold from that deeper awareness.

It is a very weird feeling at first.

Damien

12-06-2006, 11:28 AM

Dear Damien, i am a registered user at YouTube, but every link that has been posted here, by you today, or anyone else in the past, comes up in HTML or some other code...any chance you could post the titles of these clips, so i can go into the website and search for myself?

Cheers! :)

~N~

you need to watch this Nanouk. Search for Lotus "I AM" R5 commercial

Damien

12-06-2006, 11:34 AM

When children are very little, they do not identify themselves as "I" - my daughter called herself by her name for the first year of language development, before beginning to see herself as "I". In other words, "I" awareness is in itself a product of social conditioning.

I would say its diametrically opposite. A name, Daniel/Damien/Isaiah/nyk, is a product of a need for separation by implicit specificity. I am..you [am]...she [am]...yet they are unified in that individuality...with 2012, the matrix of unitarian separation "comes together" to form individualism (Leo) within community (Aquarius) and communal individuality. Synarchy...(We am)...your term. :)

This symantical point aside, I totally agree with the direction of your insight, though. What do "we" call "ourselves" once this shift has adjusted?

Karyn

12-06-2006, 11:42 AM

Out of curiosity...how many read this post of mine on the previous page,
and of those who did, how many actually took the idea and tried it
physically - for real?

-I did. I will make it a practice. I will do it with intent.
Love, Karyn

nyk

12-06-2006, 11:43 AM

The step forward for us as a species is simultaneously remaining in the individual ego-identity we developed over the last 1000s of years, but, through what Gebser calls "ego freedom," having that deeper awareness of our inseparability from the species mind and planet mind (or noosphere), so that all our actions naturally unfold from that deeper awareness.

It is a very weird feeling at first.

Yes, but how do you plan to entice others to step into this new modality?
It was something I consciously chose to do at a certain point in my life.
I had to cross a certain line within myself, one that felt like death. My
understanding of that is that no one can be made to do it except out
of sincere personal intent.

nanouk

12-06-2006, 12:08 PM

I had to cross a certain line within myself, one that felt like death. My
understanding of that is that no one can be made to do it except out
of sincere personal intent.

Snap!

I died the death of the "former" Self, like a snake shedding it's skin, a couple of years ago, (Kundalini Awakening, shamanic illness, Penny Dropping, who knows?) and swore, with absolute intent, to work towards dropping the Ego, in order to live in Now. Now has become Forever, and instead of doing the daily exercise you do, nyk, i salute the day with a "Hello!" every time i open the curtains, i say "Hello Sunshine!" when it peeps from behind an overcast sky, i salute the garden Robin, my plants, Pumice Goddess figurine on the mantlepiece, my neighbours, anything and anyone i can think of...

...and it is amazing how easy it is to keep a smile on one's face, and breathe the Now.

Thank you for your insights nyk, i can feel it is helping many people among us here, please start a Pictorial Thread tonight! :razz:

Thanks for link Damien, i like it! :) Wish i could see it as a film, not an advert! Liked the cover of REM's Superman also :cool:

Love and Respect,
~n~

Damien

12-06-2006, 12:13 PM

<3 --- peace to libra.

Damien

12-06-2006, 12:26 PM

Thanks for link Damien, i like it! :) Wish i could see it as a film, not an advert! Liked the cover of REM's Superman also :cool:

Love and Respect,
~n~

The first individual holding up the signifier of "I am" is enough to turn goosey-pimpled me. I find that there is such a truth to his knowledge within all of their apparents of selfdom to matrices.

"I never did believe in miracles, but I have a feeling its time to try...I never did believe in the ways of magic, but i'm beginning to wonder why."

nyk

12-06-2006, 01:24 PM

Thank you for your insights nyk, i can feel it is helping many people among us here, please start a Pictorial Thread tonight!

I don't think so. I think the only ones who get what I am writing are the
ones who already get it anyway. Face-to-face I could demonstrate a
number of things in short order...in just a few minutes. But here...

daniel

12-06-2006, 04:11 PM

Yes, but how do you plan to entice others to step into this new modality?
It was something I consciously chose to do at a certain point in my life.
I had to cross a certain line within myself, one that felt like death. My
understanding of that is that no one can be made to do it except out
of sincere personal intent.

My model for consciousness transformation remains the Sheldrake "morphogenetic field"/Hundredth Monkey Principle (though I know the monkey example is now considered bogus): When a certain small number of individuals make a profound shift in consciousness, that shift becomes more easily available to a much greater number - hence the few, ragged Beats of the 1950s morphed into millions of Hippies in the 1960s. Since everything is highly accelerated now, there is no reason that a process of awakening couldn't move across the entire species mind at an extraordinary rate.

My plan to entice others into this new modality was to utilize a multimedia channel and Internet platform to disseminate a new vision - if the product was fun and hip and well-marketed, I don't see why it wouldn't be widely viewed. Compassion and spirituality have become buzzwords that are seen as powerful to corporate marketers - Pepsi tells us to "oneify," Coke bottles proclaim, "Give, Live, Love"; McDonald's promotes yoga poses. Of course these are cynical gestures - but this is also the feedback these companies are recieving from their marketing people, that these are some of the only messages that still transmit. Of course they expect the trends to change again - but what if we are at the end of trends?

ocoyai

12-06-2006, 04:57 PM

not bloody likly.

What does this future look like?

Burning Man?

Im sorry but I think I am mad at this counter culture world.

all of this is so vauge. Shift. transition. etc.. Why cant really just talk about what where talking about.

It comes down to our own deaths. People have been betting on the end times for ever. But it never really happend. Everyone is waiting for time to somehow make what ever they want happen happen. Be it heaven or enlightenment or sex or love or money or even hell. It all depends on the outter movement of stuff.

It just becomes another us and them. After 2012 is it going to be. "Were the ones who consciously shifted and those are the ones who didnt"

There just seems to be large dualitys that people do not adress because always about the problems with "them".

Yes THEY are the problem, but we are they. And using what ever spiritual method you use to make yourself differnt doesn't finish the job.

Fuck if I was an indian I would want to see all these people dead. I would be mad. But would I be right?

Nature eats Nature. The only permenence is impermence. So
yes
The only thing that matters is greater love.

But does it come through.

I have been in this new age/counterculture world for awhile. I have notcied that most people still have there problems and still cant make samsara stop.

The only way to free ourselves is to let it all go and be present and creative.

What is a new modality?

Who decides what it is? Does nature really care? Is it from God. Or is just going to be another ego trip? Maybe more flashy and fun but still something for the I?

the one thing I notcied at burning man. Which so many people think is this sign post of future culture is that it is horribaly capitlistic and white. There are hardly any black people there. And I guess that is my point.

The new age and most of this stuff was started by unsatisfied well to do white people. It just seems out of touch. It seems to be arrogent.

No one even talked about this stuff(2012) before mckenna poped it out.
He's dead from a tumor

You know tons of people in the new age thought that 1987 was the end of the world.

I know I am not very coherhent but what I am trying to say

Dont let it become another trip becuase it will take you away from the real truth and source which is beyond time and matter.

And cop to the fact that this is all a cover up for the fact the people will destroy a good chunk of them selves with nuclear weapons and that is why where all a little tense.

but it is just death

and there is life everywhere

feel how ever you want but dont think that it's

nyk

12-06-2006, 05:02 PM

My model for consciousness transformation remains the Sheldrake "morphogenetic field"/Hundredth Monkey Principle (though I know the monkey example is now considered bogus): When a certain small number of individuals make a profound shift in consciousness, that shift becomes more easily available to a much greater number - hence the few, ragged Beats of the 1950s morphed into millions of Hippies in the 1960s. Since everything is highly accelerated now, there is no reason that a process of awakening couldn't move across the entire species mind at an extraordinary rate.

That will require a profound shift in consciousness in these few individuals
that is not merely psychologically but also physical, meaning that these
beings can affect material reality. Anything less than that will not have
the juice to move the field. We are talking full-fledged Qs spread across
the globe. We know this is true, because those millions of hippies got
absorbed back into the matrix.

My plan to entice others into this new modality was to utilize a multimedia channel and Internet platform to disseminate a new vision - if the product was fun and hip and well-marketed, I don't see why it wouldn't be widely viewed. Compassion and spirituality have become buzzwords that are seen as powerful to corporate marketers - Pepsi tells us to "oneify," Coke bottles proclaim, "Give, Live, Love"; McDonald's promotes yoga poses. Of course these are cynical gestures - but this is also the feedback these companies are recieving from their marketing people, that these are some of the only messages that still transmit. Of course they expect the trends to change again - but what if we are at the end of trends?

Risky venture. But I am curious about it.

nyk

12-06-2006, 05:08 PM

feel how ever you want but dont think that it's

That it's.....what? Truth? Reality? Whatever you feel is what you feel. And
that's it - you are It to yourself no matter what.

gandydancer

12-06-2006, 05:21 PM

"My plan to entice others into this new modality was to utilize a multimedia channel and Internet platform to disseminate a new vision - if the product was fun and hip and well-marketed, I don't see why it wouldn't be widely viewed. Compassion and spirituality have become buzzwords that are seen as powerful to corporate marketers - Pepsi tells us to "oneify," Coke bottles proclaim, "Give, Live, Love"; McDonald's promotes yoga poses. Of course these are cynical gestures - but this is also the feedback these companies are recieving from their marketing people, that these are some of the only messages that still transmit. Of course they expect the trends to change again - but what if we are at the end of trends?"
__________________
Perhaps video games also, for free, like the military does would be a good idea.

gandydancer

12-06-2006, 05:32 PM

I have read that paragraph over at least a half a dozen times because I just can't believe what I am reading. So it has come to that?, a marketing stratagy? Count me out.

ocoyai

12-06-2006, 05:34 PM

That it's.....what? Truth? Reality? Whatever you feel is what you feel. And
that's it - you are It to yourself no matter what.

meaning: to quote tom york

"just because you feel it, doesnt mean its there."

Damien

12-06-2006, 05:41 PM

meaning: to quote tom york

"just because you feel it, doesnt mean its there."

It's there for you though! : )

Damien

12-06-2006, 05:43 PM

I don't think so. I think the only ones who get what I am writing are the
ones who already get it anyway. Face-to-face I could demonstrate a
number of things in short order...in just a few minutes. But here...

People evolve...swoosh.

Isaiah Mpski

12-06-2006, 05:50 PM

Very good post ocoyai.
I feel likem you do.If Daniel thinks the world is going to turn into a giant burning man than he's deeper in the dumpster than I thought.
The whole western world-the world as a whole actually is so materialisticaly oriented that the whole fucking thing could collapse by spring.
One more 9-11 and youseguys are going to wish you were helping me put something together here in Oklahoma.
Compassion and spirituality in America.Bullshit.
Selfishness,greed,get everything while you can rules America.There is little justice and even fewer enlightened people.
I hope things are going better for you Nanouk.

Damien

12-06-2006, 05:51 PM

My plan to entice others into this new modality was to utilize a multimedia channel and Internet platform to disseminate a new vision - if the product was fun and hip and well-marketed, I don't see why it wouldn't be widely viewed. Compassion and spirituality have become buzzwords that are seen as powerful to corporate marketers - Pepsi tells us to "oneify," Coke bottles proclaim, "Give, Live, Love"; McDonald's promotes yoga poses. Of course these are cynical gestures - but this is also the feedback these companies are recieving from their marketing people, that these are some of the only messages that still transmit. Of course they expect the trends to change again - but what if we are at the end of trends?

I have read that paragraph over at least a half a dozen times because I just can't believe what I am reading. So it has come to that?, a marketing stratagy? Count me out.

For example, that youtube Lotus/IBM commercial I posted above. Its an add for software. Out of the teeming mass of "everyday" society, a single man, single woman proclaims "I am"...separate? combined? both?

Gently the voicesong intones, "I am, I am Superman and I know what's happening...I am, I am Superman and I can do anything." Its naive, seemingly treacly...how can anyone know what's happening even be just as they are. But the voice isn't obviously stating its Knowing or Being to take control or harm others...rather its just saying matter of fact. It directly hits upon a break-shift truth, "I am". Poking its head out from the womb of buy/sell/propagate to shakedown truth to the epistemical residual. Commercials contain particles of kernels of seeds of epiphanical reality within them when their creators make that insane tomb robbery of internal existential truth. Its the monkey.

Damien

12-06-2006, 05:53 PM

graffitirun

12-06-2006, 06:11 PM

.. Why cant we really just talk about what where talking about.

if you havent already,
check Allan Watts, and his talk entitled 'The Limits of Language'

http://deoxy.org/media/Watts

graffitirun

12-06-2006, 06:26 PM

...hence the few, ragged Beats of the 1950s morphed into millions of Hippies in the 1960s. Since everything is highly accelerated now, there is no reason that a process of awakening couldn't move across the entire species mind at an extraordinary rate.

...that these are some of the only messages that still transmit. Of course they expect the trends to change again - but what if we are at the end of trends?

I get the impression that it is now very possible, according to these easily observed accelerations, to utilize or reconfigure the pent up and screaming intertia of all this current folly & horror. A surprise, twist ending, in other words. At just the last second, which we're in.. the poison tipped arrow is re-fitted, in mid-flight, with a healthy, healing, antidote.

-
coke- what goes around. by nagi noda
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPlMKz4-7nA

daniel

12-06-2006, 06:56 PM

daniel

12-06-2006, 07:08 PM

That will require a profound shift in consciousness in these few individuals
that is not merely psychologically but also physical, meaning that these
beings can affect material reality.

Everyone is affecting material reality all the time. My sense of magic is that it happens ("naturally" or "automatically"?) when you are in a right relationship to things.

nyk: "... those millions of hippies got absorbed back into the matrix."

I think it is far more complex than that. Reality changed drastically and permanently after the 60s - think of the sexual repressive hysteria of the 1950s and the more open (if "repressively desublimated") erotic culture we have had since. I think most people would agree that, in balance, it has been an improvement. The psychedelic vision was absorbed into the arts, advertising, and into the tech culture that created the computer and Internet (check out the book What the Doormouse Said). In many profound ways, the hippies changed the matrix forever.

There's a new book about Stewart Brand, Whole Earth, WELL, and digital culture - has anyone checked it out? I hear its briliant.

nyk

12-06-2006, 07:43 PM

graffitirun

12-06-2006, 08:12 PM

the hippies changed the matrix forever.

William Gibson on hippies, commodification, bohemian dreamtime...

http://graffitirun.net/william-gibson001.htm

daniel

12-06-2006, 10:59 PM

hi nyk,

that's great you have your practice - i am a bit allergic to people trying to force their practices on others, but if people feel like trying it, now you have told them how.

nyk

12-06-2006, 11:42 PM

that's great you have your practice - i am a bit allergic to people trying to force their practices on others, but if people feel like trying it, now you have told them how.

That's not what I am trying to do. I'm attempting to convey a principle.
Everyone's practice is different, and I haven't really said much about mine
in any real detail. I only brought up the hand movement as a way of
trying to demonstrate physically what words cannot do. Okay, so it
isn't working. I get it.

Karyn

12-07-2006, 03:00 AM

That's not what I am trying to do. I'm attempting to convey a principle.
Everyone's practice is different, and I haven't really said much about mine
in any real detail. I only brought up the hand movement as a way of
trying to demonstrate physically what words cannot do. Okay, so it
isn't working. I get it.

Hi Nyk, I think it's a good idea. We choose a goal and focus our intent but there also needs to be some type of physical demonstration to complete the programming. That is what ritual was all about. It is an outer demonstration of the inner intention. The Self Conscious chooses a goal. The Subconscious catches on to what is to be created by the mental images and also the physical demonstration. You told me before of your practice but I did not think it necessary until now.
I am sure you were inspired by your inner guidance. And I also feel this urge you have to share your knowledge is coming from your heart.
Love, Karyn

nanouk

12-07-2006, 04:29 AM

Poking its head out from the womb of buy/sell/propagate to shakedown truth to the epistemical residual. Commercials contain particles of kernels of seeds of epiphanical reality within them when their creators make that insane tomb robbery of internal existential truth. Its the monkey.

"And the monkey has the key..."

Kasabian "Cut Off"

~n~

nanouk

12-07-2006, 05:00 AM

craazyman

12-07-2006, 06:55 AM

gandydancer

12-07-2006, 07:09 AM

I am trying to keep an open mind on the marketing idea...

Coke sells Coke, McDonalds sells Happy Meals.

What is the product that you want to market?

(BTW, Chomsky agrees with Daniel that the 60's resulted in a huge shift in consciousness.)

nanouk

12-07-2006, 07:26 AM

When you demand it, and buy it, they'll happily get rich selling it to you. It's not "business" that's the problem. Do you know how much money is pouring into venture capital funds right now for eco-businesses, green power, sustainability, solar, etc? Like Carl Sagan said "Billions and billions." It's not the 1980s anymore. Youze guys are way behind the curve.:p :p

????

"Venture" is exactly what it is...every time i mention "Solar Panels" to people i know have some decent capitol behind themselves, they are house owners, so-called green, and are about to renovate their property, they shake their heads and say it is too expensive.

Fuck expense! Fuck eco-investment! Fuck the billions!

Only 1% of our population invest in the future through their homes, laugh at that eighties curve craazy!

*steaming* :mad: ~ crawling back into the Dragon's Lair...

~n~

okster

12-07-2006, 07:35 AM

Daniel wrote:
"There's a new book about Stewart Brand, Whole Earth, WELL, and digital culture - has anyone checked it out? I hear its brilliant."

Had not yet heard about this. Here it is at Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/0226817415/
Counterculture to Cyberculture: Stewart Brand, the Whole Earth Network, and the Rise of Digital Utopianism - Fred Turner - 354 pages - University of Chicago Press
(it would have 5 stars, but Stewart himself gave it 4, since he didn't feel it would be right to give a book about himself 5 stars)

Looks like a serious book.

The Whole Earth Catalog was one of the most magical, powerful, and world-changing books ever. I used to spend hours and hours going through those books. (you can still find them at garage sales, used bookstores, library sales, ebay, etc.) Later, they started up Co-Evolution Quarterly - the coolest magazine ever (by FAR!) - which later turned into Whole Earth Review and then just Whole Earth and finally faded away just a few years ago. They still have a website here: http://www.wholeearthmag.com/
No longer being updated, but might be some cool articles online. Worth seeking out back issues at eBay.

I never joined up at the WELL, which I think got started long before the Internet really took off. Looks like it is still happening, and might be worth checking into: http://www.well.com
I guess what kept me away is that you have to pay (currently $10-$15 per month). On one hand, I guess that keeps the riff-raff out, but I've always thought that an important part of the great promise of the web is that its free.

The Whole Earth magazine didn't even have advertising (until the very end of its history). Possibly better business management would have kept it going.

Just putting the big picture of the Earth on the cover of the giant book was a very magical act.

craazyman

12-07-2006, 08:09 AM

L. Sami, it is too cloudy for solar in England, but there's great offshore wind power resources. This isn't something people can do on their own, per se. And solar is still too expensive for utility-grade installations, that's true too, but in 10-15 years it will be competitive with coal and nuke in many areas worldwide. I won't even go into a public energy policy digression, that would just give you a headache.

Gandy, you never answered my question about non-Euclidian geometry, but I'll ask you this: I'm 6' 1", I weigh 175 lbs with very low body fat, I can do the steepest tilt on a cardiac stress test without breathing hard, I can do 10 pullups without touching the ground, I work out daily and I do a 4.5 forty. I'm in my mid-40s, do you think there's any chance I can make it in the NFL as a deep safety or cornerback? I'm looking for a new career with a bit more pay. I know you're a health care professional, so I appreciate your opinion.

BTW, I don't drink Coke or eat at McDonalds. Usually, it's water at mealtime, lean meats and fresh veggies. I can get all those at McDonalds if I want, but I don't like the decor.

Damien

12-07-2006, 08:36 AM

I agree with you there, Daniel, i have long wanted to explore the possibility of using the alchemical or homeopathic method of "treating evil with evil", and reverse the brainwashing/conditioning with businesses' own medicine.

It doesn't have to be a "product" per se, an idea is also a product.

I know it isn't good to project one's beliefs and ideas on other's, but if enough of us globally agree, including powerful medicine men/women, shamans/esses and great thinkers/healers, artists and musical performers, that something unifying has to be done, then i believe it is part of the Great Work.

I am a firm believer that if one sows a seed(in someone's head), with enough care it can grow into something magnificent - or evil.

The difference between "white" and "black" magick.

I just thought, Homer Simpson has a powerful mantra "douw!", so does Bart, "Save the whales, man!", Ali G. "Aii!", Catherine Tate, "Am i bovvered?"

It's got to be popular culture, like a cartoon, to create a mindset and mantra so powerful, that the fully fledged Q's someone talked about, can hear the mantra's loudly enough to home in on the "prey" and create the cosmic balance needed to make Coca Cola fx. have to shut it's gates for good. :D

Love and Respect,

~N~

Religions are public relations firms between the Divine and the Earthly. Marketing campaigns are failing as the hook isn't sinking into the teeth of the target market. Although in Boulder, Buddhism has managed to pretty much commodify itself through the use of buzzy aculturisms such as "dharma", "practice", "cushion", "sitting", "compassion"...that these practices alter states is quadrary to the penentration, dissemination, and ultimately spreading of a "message". If there is a goal, it would be to take the middleman out of the spiritual equation, a substance like DMT could activate as a spiritual E-bay?. Pah.

nyk

12-07-2006, 08:38 AM

Hi Nyk, I think it's a good idea. We choose a goal and focus our intent but there also needs to be some type of physical demonstration to complete the programming. That is what ritual was all about. It is an outer demonstration of the inner intention. The Self Conscious chooses a goal. The Subconscious catches on to what is to be created by the mental images and also the physical demonstration. You told me before of your practice but I did not think it necessary until now.
I am sure you were inspired by your inner guidance. And I also feel this urge you have to share your knowledge is coming from your heart.
Love, Karyn

A complete thought is one that touches matter. It doesn't really matter
what thoughts you have (except to you) or what physical movements
you make, only that mind and body think and move in unison. That is
the entire secret of magic. Of course that has to be a conscious
exercise. It can become automatic and entirely empty very easily,
as it has with the Buddhists, the Catholics....well, with everyone. A
formula. That's why I offered something simple. It follows the torus.
We are toruses. The Heart is the Soul, is the Core, is God. You are It.
Ah, but it is so easy to herniate into purgatories; everyone is lost
in abstractions. Divorced from Nature. Nature is not cool anymore,
unless it is sterilized and prepackaged and doled out as entertainment.
Daniel says he is allergic to what I write. He is really allergic to life
and is addicted to specious ideologies. And he is tethered to herd
consciousness. The herd has already died on the psychic level. But
I guess that's hard to see if one is in it.

Damien

12-07-2006, 08:39 AM

"And the monkey has the key..."

Kasabian "Cut Off"

~n~

and that commercial came out in '99 or '00 i believe, along with another sampling "Bitter Sweet Symphony" by The Verve...I was only 18 at the time but I could sense a new paradigm in market being created...along with a diverse Mtv, Disney Channel etc. The arrival of the current administration sent ascendant values in creative commerce down the hole.

nanouk

12-07-2006, 08:41 AM

L. Sami, it is too cloudy for solar in England, but there's great offshore wind power resources. This isn't something people can do on their own, per se. And solar is still too expensive for utility-grade installations, that's true too, but in 10-15 years it will be competitive with coal and nuke in many areas worldwide. I won't even go into a public energy policy digression, that would just give you a headache.

Please give me a headache, i don't mind learning what you know about public energy policy, i used a public grant for insulating my old house a few years ago.

“Its too expensive!”
“there’s not enough sunshine in this country”
are the typical responses when you mention Solar Panels UK
"Not True"
Solar panels work even on COLD CLOUDY days in the UK (http://www.heatmyhome.co.uk/)

See the link on grants... ;)

I was talking about discussions with some of my more affluent acquaintances*[sp.]

Keep warm, it is storming here, but plenty of free firewood for all!

Peace,

~N~

Damien

12-07-2006, 08:45 AM

nanouk

12-07-2006, 09:08 AM

Right, i invested a small sum, £200, in a venture capital fund (high risk ISA) back in 2001, it is now in 2006 standing at £256.

Two years ago i did a short term investment when i was flush, and turned over £2000 to £2200 in 3 months(low risk ISA, obviously investing in non PC companies)

Who will invest in something that won't give a good return? Only someone like Richard Branson, (I Bow To Him).

~n~

daniel

12-07-2006, 09:17 AM

nyk: "Daniel says he is allergic to what I write. He is really allergic to life
and is addicted to specious ideologies. And he is tethered to herd
consciousness. The herd has already died on the psychic level. But
I guess that's hard to see if one is in it. "

oh please, get over it. what crap.

the need to create drama in these virtual formats is utterly tedious - post all the practices you want, say whatever you want. I just don't like repeated exhortations to do what you want me to do, and i reserve my right to express that.

craazyman

12-07-2006, 09:26 AM

Please give me a headache, i don't mind learning what you know about public energy policy, i used a public grant for insulating my old house a few years ago.

I will provide a thoughtful response, but have a full plate this afternoon work-wise. It's encouraging that you're interested enough in the topic to do the work you've done on it.

nyk

12-07-2006, 09:33 AM

oh please, get over it. what crap.

the need to create drama in these virtual formats is utterly tedious - post all the practices you want, say whatever you want. I just don't like repeated exhortations to do what you want me to do, and i reserve my right to express that.

You slipped up and capitalized your 'I' above. :rolleyes:

nyk

12-07-2006, 09:33 AM

nanouk

12-07-2006, 09:42 AM

I will provide a thoughtful response, but have a full plate this afternoon work-wise. It's encouraging that you're interested enough in the topic to do the work you've done on it.

I will watch this space.

Have a good day at the office, remember to stretch every two hours! ;)

~n~

nanouk

12-07-2006, 11:04 AM

and that commercial came out in '99 or '00 i believe, along with another sampling "Bitter Sweet Symphony" by The Verve...I was only 18 at the time but I could sense a new paradigm in market being created...along with a diverse Mtv, Disney Channel etc. The arrival of the current administration sent ascendant values in creative commerce down the hole.

funnily enough, i have found that commercials over here are more and more portraying our species as neanderthals or actually, less intelligent than both nean's and animals!

the seven deadly sins seem to re-occur in all TV adverts about deodorants, cars, jeans, food, etc. anyone else from england that agree? or disagree?

Love and Respect,

~n~

graffitirun

12-07-2006, 11:39 AM

You slipped up and capitalized your "I". :rolleyes:

eye ca-rhumba!

http://plaatjes.hemisphere.nl/302884.jpg

:snore:

nyk

12-07-2006, 11:47 AM

Yeah, but look at this....

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/5557/2012zo5.jpg

:eek:

graffitirun

12-07-2006, 12:24 PM

oh yeah?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4NIMl4ogQA

;)

nyk

12-07-2006, 12:29 PM

It's fun being a coyote. That ball coming back around really breaks open
the head.

nanouk

12-07-2006, 12:34 PM

oh yeah?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4NIMl4ogQA

;)

Link name, please? i can't seem to get more than code from clicking on youtube links... :errf:

~n~

nanouk

12-07-2006, 12:39 PM

Damien

12-07-2006, 02:04 PM

...speaking of marketing ascension and the seven deadly sins, two years ago the main ice cream company in Sweden, GB, launched a new range, seven different flavours named after the sins, greed, gluttony, pride, etc.

very clever... :)

~N~

interesting, i know in Boulder, Ben and Jerry's sits amid the rush of all other sentient establishments who attempt to manipulate your eyes for profit inside their minds.

nyk

12-07-2006, 02:38 PM

I would have expected something more like this...

http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/2056/2012byi1.jpg

[sorry, no photoshop or whatever]

Karyn

12-07-2006, 03:13 PM

nyk; A complete thought is one that touches matter. It doesn't really matter what thoughts you have (except to you) or what physical movements you make, only that mind and body think and move in unison. That is the entire secret of magic. Of course that has to be a conscious exercise. It can become automatic and entirely empty very easily,
as it has with the Buddhists, the Catholics....well, with everyone. A formula. That's why I offered something simple. It follows the torus We are toruses. The Heart is the Soul, is the Core, is God. You are It. Ah, but it is so easy to herniate into purgatories; everyone is lost in abstractions. Divorced from Nature. Nature is not cool anymore, unless it is sterilized and prepackaged and doled out as entertainment.

-Hi Nyk, Yes it is true we need to know what the physical demonstration means. I just happened to be reading last night about how we create. How does the thought touch matter. It has to be a thought that has a clear image with it. Some thoughts are vague and do not create a good mental image. The reason the torus is a good image- mental image and physical demonstration is because it is true- a truth that the universal consciousness knows--recognizes. Yes a lot of truth has been lost in ritual. They forgot the true reason for the ritual -- The reason for the visual hints. It is to program the Subconscious. I wonder why the ones that do know do not share this knowledge. We need knowledge. I am thinking it may be because knowledge is power and they do not want to share. My girlfriend at work is from Taiwan. She is not into the studies like I am and does not believe anything she cannot touch and see in the physical. I told her I liked the movie "Crouching Tiger and Hidden Dragon" She told me- and was very serious that they really could jump that high as though flying. Up in the trees..just like in the move. The reason they cannot do it anymore is because the teaching became lost. Every Master held back a little truth because they wanted to be the best. Better then the students. This went on and on until the teachings were lost. Love, Karyn
(Of course they are not really lost- Subconscious records everything.)

nanouk

12-07-2006, 04:21 PM

interesting, i know in Boulder, Ben and Jerry's sits amid the rush of all other sentient establishments who attempt to manipulate your eyes for profit inside their minds.

...any comments? :cool:

nanouk

12-07-2006, 04:25 PM

Karyn wrote: "The reason the torus is a good image- mental image and physical demonstration is because it is true- a truth that the universal consciousness knows--recognizes."

The Apple.

Google says: "Adam Mammoth and Eve Mammoth sat under an Apple Tree......"

With No Diss-Respect,

~n~

nyk

12-07-2006, 11:00 PM

-Hi Nyk, Yes it is true we need to know what the physical demonstration means. I just happened to be reading last night about how we create. How does the thought touch matter. It has to be a thought that has a clear image with it. Some thoughts are vague and do not create a good mental image.

Yes, I use images too. That is a big part I guess. The other thing is
to feel thru one's body...feel the thoughts and intents in your skin and
bones. Our body is a holographic chamber...perhaps.

The reason the torus is a good image- mental image and physical demonstration is because it is true- a truth that the universal consciousness knows--recognizes.

I believe there is a matrix program block with regards to this feature. It
took me a long time to move past conceptual with it. Reminds me of
the amnesia effects of alien communion. Weird. Even M at RSE still
doesn't see it, and it has been in his face for some 20 years. Some-
thing is stopping us from turning it on. Interestingly, as I type this
there are some very strange things occuring. Loud tinitus. Burning
skin around the front of my lower neck (that's a new one).

Yes a lot of truth has been lost in ritual. They forgot the true reason for the ritual -- The reason for the visual hints. It is to program the Subconscious. I wonder why the ones that do know do not share this knowledge. We need knowledge. I am thinking it may be because knowledge is power and they do not want to share. My girlfriend at work is from Taiwan. She is not into the studies like I am and does not believe anything she cannot touch and see in the physical. I told her I liked the movie "Crouching Tiger and Hidden Dragon" She told me- and was very serious that they really could jump that high as though flying. Up in the trees..just like in the move. The reason they cannot do it anymore is because the teaching became lost. Every Master held back a little truth because they wanted to be the best. Better then the students. This went on and on until the teachings were lost. Love, Karyn
(Of course they are not really lost- Subconscious records everything.)

They can do it now with a technique called wire-fu. ;)

craazyman

12-08-2006, 02:38 AM

Please give me a headache

Yes I can understand your frustration at seeing your fellow royalty flinch at the (for them) modest cost of a home solar installation. These types of home solar heating and photovoltaic systems have been around since the 1970s energy crisis & I do agree that they can augment utility power on sunny days, even in England.

But there several problems with them as complete energy solutions for society at large. They don't work at night. They don't work on dark, cloudy days. Even on sunny days, they don't have produce enough power to run a house (the links you provided acknowledge this, and pitch these as supplemental systems). Even with tax credits, the up-front investment cost is too expensive for the vast majority of people. The payback period is usually 10-20 years or more. They are nowhere near cost-competitive with the price of utility power, which runs usually from about 7 to 12 cents/kilowatt hour.

So technically your friends are right. These systems are not cost effective on a cash basis for someone connected to the grid. Here in the U.S. (and especially in California) we also have generous subsidies at the federal and state level for home solar power. It's good public policy and every little bit helps, but it's not a complete, clean energy solution for society as a whole.

There are three types of electricity demand--baseload, mid-merit and peaker. Baseload is 24 hour, non-stop demand, all night and all day. Mid-merit is morning when people wake up, and evening when they get home from work. Peaker is afternoons in summer on very hot days, AC demand, etc.

Electricity cannot be economically stored due to technical constraints, and so it has to be produced and consumed at the same time. If society wants baseload power, then solar is totally out of the question (lacking cost effective electricity storage technology, anyway), the same goes to a large extent for mid-merit on early mornings and evenings when the sunlight is weak.

So, if society wants electricity on all the time, and if it wants it to be relatively cheap, then other generation technologies are required. There are only three economical generation technologies for baseload power--coal, nuclear and natural gas. Coal is the dirtiest, natural gas is much cleaner, nuclear is emissions free, but the nuclear waste storage issue remains a policy challenge. (Although folks such as Greenpeace co-founder Patrick Moore now advocate nuclear as a solution to CO2 emissions.)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/14/AR2006041401209.html

Large scale utility grade wind installations are now cost competitive with natural gas and some coal, but the intermittency of wind prohibits wind power from being effective as a sole source for baseload demand.

Public policy in the U.S. and globally recognizes that society demands 24 hour electricity for residential, commercial and industrial use. And it also recognizes that people are demanding cleaner power. In fact, U.S. air has gotten much cleaner since the Clean Air Act was implemented in the 1970s (cleaner in terms of reduced emissions of NOx, SO2, etc.) I doubt many people realize this, but the progress has been significant nationwide.

http://www.epa.gov/airtrends/econ-emissions.html

And the progress will continue. Last year, the Environmental Protection Agency issued the Clean Air Interstate Rule, which enforces much steeper cuts in emissions over the next several years, implemented through a "cap and trade" program, which everyone in the power business is very comfortable with.

http://www.epa.gov/cair/

So things are getting much better and will continue to get even better. But there are still problems. First, why should we have any emissions at all, isn't zero emissions best. Second, the CO2 problem--carbon is not a regulated pollutant under EPA jurisdiction (although a case is now being heard by the U.S. supreme court on that issue).

Home solar power is less of a society-wide answer than utility scale clean power (combination of solar, wind, geothermal, tidal, etc.), in my view, do to the economies of scale. Central station power is simply much, much cheaper by any measure, barring any totally new power technologies.

The most interesting developments in solar are moving away from silicon-based photovoltaics and into other, cheaper methods.

http://www.nanosolar.com/

This may be a good solution for peak power, but not baseload.

Ultimately, we can't get away from coal and nukes. Not either, but both. Coal can be much cleaner than it is, and will get cleaner. Integrated Coal Gasification Combined Cycle technology (turning coal into clean burning natural gas) is evolving to the point where it can be relatively clean.

Regulatory policy is also looking at ways of changing utility rate structures to incentivize energy efficiency programs. The CEO of Duke Energy in the U.S. calls efficiency "the fifth fuel". It's more than talk at this point.

There's a lot going on in terms of public policy to incentivize clean power--at the state level there are renewable portfolio standards that require utilities to produce increasing amounts of power from wind, solar, geothermal etc. The energy bill passed in 2005 provides tax credits for utility scale renewable generation.

lacking any leadership from the Bush administration, Carbon policy is being formed at the state level in the U.S. with regional greehouse gas initiatives in New England/Mid-Atlantic, new carbon laws in California, etc.

There's quite a lot going on that's very positive.

Is it too late? I don't know. But I'm inclined to be optimistic that things will work out fairly well.

This is a fairly lengthy post. But the topic is so huge and complex that it could be 30 times longer and more detailed.

Yes, people could just cut their power use by 50% and we wouldn't need all this confusion. But they won't. and so we have to deal with that. And that's where the stuff that Daniel is talking about comes in.

nanouk

12-08-2006, 03:13 AM

thank you for your time and effort, craazyman. Yes i do agree that on an industrial scale solar powered cells just aren't feasible, but since the cost to install it is no more than any gas fed central heating system in an average 3 bedroom house, i think it is worth it, if it could provide, say, half of the electricity needed for a household.

it is not true they dont work at night, i have danced away for hours after dark to a powerful sound system, fed by just one 18"x30" unit...and at night it is mainly refridgeration, freezers and other appliances that need lots of energy.

i agree with Patrick Moore, nuclear power is the only option for the next 50 or so years, that is why is wrote that Einstein must be :) , when i posted about the new nuclear fusion, not fission plant planned to be built in Marseille, hoping to provide 30 countries with electricity, i think it was 2 weeks ago.

i remember when i was a child, back in sweden, the nation held a referendum, and the slogan was "No To Nuclear Power!" the outcome was to abolish the method by 2005. it just ain't gonna happen...

Nuclear Power in Sweden (http://www.uic.com.au/nip39.htm)

also, i am happy the CO2 issue is finally on the board again in the US, since the first thing G.W.Bush did when he was elected was to scrap the Kyoto Agreement *shudder* nearly worse than fiddling with the votes in Florida 4 years later...

thanks again, have a nice day! :)

Love and Respect,
~n~

ocoyai

12-08-2006, 05:25 AM

if you havent already,
check Allan Watts, and his talk entitled 'The Limits of Language'

http://deoxy.org/media/Watts

dude thats my boy. No one better. I have to listen to that one again.

Go on amazon and buy Joyess Cosmology.

Its all his drug trips compiled into one day.

But seriously what where we talking about?

ocoyai

12-08-2006, 06:02 AM

gandydancer,

it is not that it "all comes down to a marketing strategy," but the concept would be to use the tools of the system to transform the system. In alchemy, the idea is that the poisons are the most powerful medicines, used properly. The culture of business is the most toxic poison on the planet right now - hence, those same tools, repurposed, could be the most powerful medicine.

Allen Ginsberg worked in PR and Marketing during the early days of the Beats, and used those tools self-consciously to craft the image of a movement as a way to create - entice - cultural change.

ocoyai,

so you have criticisms, and some of them are somewhat valid ones... so what? now what? reject the counterculture for being lightweight, and where do you go after that?

it is so easy to reject and so hard to build.

Yes it is hard to build, very hard if everone isnt looking at the same plans. But I am not rejecting the CC. I was born and raised in Santa Barbara CA. A rich beach town with a bunch of new age nuts. I have been around so many week minded, looking for whatever comes along qausi spititual answer people, that I get pissed. I get pissed that people need to mask what is going on behind some metaphysical veil because they dont have heart to be true.

Its like at the daime. Some of those people are so wraped up in weridness there a hundred miles from the truth. Do I reject the daime because of that? No. The daime is the daime. As they say. Just because some people arnt very smart and cant just get real I dont get rid a the shinning gem that has giving me so much life.

And I am doing things. And I am on the same page with you. The first post you responded to is a great example. Hippies are so fucking retard. The think the medium is the message. IT IS A MEDIUM. It is there to transmit thoughts and feelings and ideas. Its not poison. The content maybe. But not the tools. The same with everything. There are two sides to a knife. We do need to make films and books and art. Those are the only things that ever made some one inspired in my opinon. Real inspirtion. Where you come to the place to create what you want.

All of it is victumhood. It is them. It is them. That is really empowering.

"Dont watch tv. Its all nonsense." You know what your fucking stupid. Why would any one who thinks they have some grasp on the truth reject anything in the first place. The ONLY way to get out of the suffering is to INCLUDE and improvise and keep your heart there. A good stich of people in the CC are very disempowerd and lack any real drive other than eating organic food, playing tam tams and smoke weed. GREAT. but the world is a lot of things. And not having the heart. The real heart, that sees the bullshit but loves humanity non the less.

Do people even realize how difficult it is to create convencing media? Look at most of the documentarys that come from the CC. There usally shit. Because they dont raise any money because they dont know how. And they dont even know how to make stuff because the live in organ(no offense to those in organ, it just sounds the funniest) and shoot with there dv camera and put some dip shit effect on it.

And thats it. CRAFTING AN IMAGE as you say. Look at the image of good amount of people in this big ol rainbow gravy train CC. Its not something you would really want to watch. WHY. Becuase it is boring. WHY. because it has no edge, or orginality. Think if you brought some wierd burner to a real deal art to do in New York. People would rail you. Why? Oh because there just assholes. Yeah. Well maybe. But arnt we all. They would rail because they would be like //// Uh huh.. Hu...Uh huh. Ok..Thats great. Im going to talk to someone that actully is doing something. Not just danicing around like noodle not really knowing anything about anything because they dont want to be in this frequency...

Drama and Media. Music. Art. These are where the ideas can get out. But you have to know how to communicate the information. And that takes talent, hard work, and dedication.

I mean you cant tell me honestly, Daniel, that being where your from and your family, that meeting with a lot of these people on your travels. That you didnt think they where full of malarki.

The CC is lightweight sometimes because its a bunch of mismanged non sense that doesnt help a human being get to reality.

I will admit I am a cynical bitch. But after sitting around with differnt people and feeling so uncomfortable with them because they are trying so hard to be this magic loving person they think they are. So Sensitive. Never breaking eye contact because that would mean that wornt being fullly present "enough" and the other person wouldnt have the experiance of "full love". Non sense. "your where molested when your where eight. LSD rangled your brain(for the better lets hope), being is happy is nice, but you will die and so will all experiance. Get real and lets talk about something that has some substance.

Like a hard debated idea system. rather than your book on aliens from zeti reticuli that are making crystals for the grand alignment of the higher spheres.

Of course lets build. But I dont think we even know who we are yet. Or who we are to each other. So it isnt going to be so easy.

But it works itself out. Through Dialouge. The only way.

bassicly
everyone always needs to be doing a reality check
and
we all going to do our best
we really are.
And lets collab and make shit transform-create. Fuck waiting for it happing. I dont have that much time

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6088867521723616224&q=terrence+mckenna&hl=en

god I miss this guy.

love

Isaiah Mpski

12-08-2006, 06:06 AM

Send me your money and ye shall be blessed.
John D. Son
POB 243
Checotah,Ok 74426

"Jesus take the Wheel"comes to mind.I can still see that little girl crossing the rairoad track.
Another is 30 years ago I was being crucified and have not been properly rewarded for my acts of bravery and thought and luckiery.
Daniel you know I like to tease but serious shit man,I have found the perfect spot for you to ascend to whatever your dreams may be in Mexico.
From a bone of contention,you could be a holy fuzz ball and pass out the real shit.
Me,I wanting to be riding an ass,till we get to that little vineyard.
I really got enthused when I found Oral Robert's Cottage on Lake Eufaula,Okla.I got the deed from the Dole family in Hawaii and I'm sure she would verify Oral was there and thus whatever.Holy Sit.That's what I'll do.Let people sit on the throne for say 20-30 minutes at a time. We might even open up a restrauant there brothers and sisters.Rob you can sell shit-handwritten on bark of the Birch.Land of the beavers.So cold in the winter you are glad you are a man.You little chickenshit.I dare you to come here and survive like the Indians did for a season.And then you might know God and what it is really like to be in shape CrazyMan..
I can put in 10 K.I need four altogether.Our little piece of property on the Interstate appraised out at 2.3.
By the way where is and how is brother Wilson-whom I admire as a great writer-RA.

craazyman

12-08-2006, 06:27 AM

i'm there. it's clear to me that ocoyai has entreprenurial potential and could be employed by us in some sort of managerial or sales position.

Isaiah Mpski

12-08-2006, 06:33 AM

And what are you going to do Lord?
Tithe CM.That's what's it's all about.Now is the time to buy land in Mexico,and while you are young grow 40 acres of purple hull peas or tomatoes.Get tan,catch fish,enjoy life while you can for if you are lucky someday you might grow old.

Damien

12-08-2006, 07:37 AM

i'm there. it's clear to me that ocoyai has entreprenurial potential and could be employed by us in some sort of managerial or sales position.

.....haha!..... <---(only included the dots because of the message limit requirement, is there anyway to get rid of it?)

ocoyai

12-09-2006, 08:33 AM

yes. lets sell the trip.
lets tan our skulls with store bought sun
and laugh at our american pun
get our fresh faced neural clense to
be the trade of all men
then as the dawning of the guiding image
that has been prersent, yet hiddin for thousands of years
comes
we purge creatures of revelery
and make our money melt guns
tie up all the loose ends
and corode the undone
whip the reseverd with
sights fantastic
and greet the new champions
with tales of the one

Isaiah Mpski

12-10-2006, 02:24 PM

Sail the skies and ride the waves.
Always look ahead for a better day.
Peace on earth and good life for all.
Except Scientology.Let it fall.

Isaiah Mpski

12-10-2006, 02:28 PM

Tonight we are eating venison and squriell(is that the right spelling Damien) cooked over an open flame.
Drink cheap wine and watch the cowboys play a game.

It's great to be an Indian.

craazyman

12-10-2006, 02:44 PM

but not a Redskin . . .:confused:

It's your year.

Isaiah Mpski

12-10-2006, 03:07 PM

Lord CM.I think we might get you adopted if you are interested in becoming a member of a tribe.Some of the tribes allow adoptions.
I have a very thick old book that has a copy of every treaty made between any Indian tribe and the US government.
What is the real interesting thing in them-for that is being sorted out in the courts-but it is the names of some of the Indians who signed them.Some of them are hilarious.Of course they always made an x mark but beside the x is the pronunciation and the meaning.I sometimes stay awake at night reading them and I kinda see where my ironic humor comes from.

God bless our troops in Iraq and anywhere else and bring them all home safe and sound to this potentially wonderful country we live.

wallace

12-12-2006, 12:50 PM

A more generous review for U.K version in Feb put on amazon.co.uk

Wallace

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/customer-reviews/preview-review.html/203-9534517-7730314

wallace

12-13-2006, 05:52 AM

Into Gebser, Nietzche,Benjamin, Steiner you will dig this big time. Also check out his great website www.breakingopenthehead.com. But Daniel needs to break open his heart as well!

This is a more important,more profound work than B.O.T.H. The highlight of it for me was the section on Santo Daime. I was disappointed he didn't report on Santo Daime members views on 2012 etc. If substantial conversations weren't had this should have been explained. Also "Forest of Visions" a book on Santo Daime was ignored, why?

Like others I found his views on women objectionable. If he wanted to include this material then there replies should have been incorporated into the text in italics! He will have some explaining to do to his daughter when she grows up and reads this!

There was a little too much of the "I have been chosen" refrain in this book, also I found his transmission unremarkable so a bit more humility would have been useful. I feel the importance he gives to his transmission unbalances the book. When he says the Daime will be with you forever that means these experiences will be commonplace, so get used to them! The change of title for the U.K is wise.

He writes beautifully which is something is undervalued in this New Age, so despite the odd problem it merits five stars.

The book will grow on you!

daniel

12-13-2006, 08:38 AM

I don't understand why you say "Forest of Visions" was ignored. I actually cited and quoted from it at length.

wallace

12-14-2006, 02:48 AM

Well effectively ignored, I know you cited it briefly but I feel you could have got a lot more from it, have you read it closely? I just get a lot from it and feel there was more there for you to get your teeth into there.

Your book has provoked strong reactions and people have reacted by giving it one or two stars which I think is to hugely undervalue it in my opinion. That it is getting strong reactions shows you have struck a nerve, you will just need a thick skin to cope with this. This is the price of being a spokesman. But the book is having an impact!

My review is very personal but you wrote from the heart and I tried to emulate you, without wishing to be rude to you. A ricochet effect!

Breaking open the head is easy compared to breaking open the heart, at least it is for me.

Have you got someone in the U.K doing your publicity? I can think of a couple of radio shows over here who should be interested in interviewing you.
Contact me off list if I can feed my suggestions through to your U.K publicist so it can make as much impact on us Brits as possible!

For me personally your description of Santo Daime is something I will treasure, thank you for that.

In your next book it would be great if you could lay into the cult around Ken Wilber! Talk about overhyped!

Sunny thoughts,
Wallace

Caprinardo Delirio

12-14-2006, 03:50 AM

ha ha ha...

nanouk

12-14-2006, 03:51 AM

Breaking open the head is easy compared to breaking open the heart, at least it is for me.

Sunny thoughts,
Wallace

it seems to me that you have successfully figured out how to make those walls tumble down, and struck a bond with the One... :cool:

we have always been told that women "think" with their hearts and men with their heads...and i think teaching the two to cooperate makes room for much wider spectrum of thought and insight.

Love and Respect,
~n~

Isaiah Mpski

12-14-2006, 04:29 AM

...and better Nanouky...LOL

Daniel this is it.I've asked you seververal times to put your money where your mouth is.
If you don't answer US here,right in this CIA and Scientology infested site of the worms of decay,then I hope someone e-mails you a copy of this post,bird head.
Are you interested in putin in 10 k,along with me and perhaps at least one more partner and buying some old vineyards NW of Gudalajara.
By the way Lord CM,I hope you will remember us when you collect a big bonus this year.We could sure use some implements for our organic tractor perhaps even a big piece of machinery or even a donation to our"Acquire Mexico"fund backed by Oklahoma real estate.including at least 1200 mineral acres in McIntosh county with 2 producing wells.
A producing oil well in Carter County and 40 mineral acres in Ft Worth(where coincidently i grew up

Isaiah Mpski

12-14-2006, 05:10 AM

Come on Lord CM.I saw where you fat cats back east got some big bonuses yesterday.
Will they let you open it before Christmas?
Let's get together and but Daniel a place in Mexico.
Have you been following KGBC.ob?
I think-hope- I'm going to make some cash soon in the gas market.Can't help but go up.
Some advice here brother-tell me what is happening to SHI-seriously,can you tell what's happening with them?

craazyman

12-15-2006, 01:30 AM

a big bonus? I wish. I'm a self-employed writer/editor/analyst kind of like the migrant laborers, just hanging on like a white collar ditch digger and keep the invoice payments coming in and trying to put as much $$ in the bank as I can. I can't even bring myself to read those bonus stories, too frustrating now that one would come in handy. I left that life a long time ago.

Heading to Mexico sounds like a good idea and on my more frustrating days I'd be half inclined to head to Oklahoma and go with you. But I sort of did that already, metaphorically speaking, back in the 80s. Got out of college and came to NY with a suitcase and train ticket, didn't know a soul, got a job to pay my apartment rent and it happened to be on "Wall Street" and 3 years later I somehow was a VP analyst at a major investment banking firm flying around the country visiting CEOs and recommending stocks and making more money than my dad ever did. But hated the work and hated the culture I worked within, and left all of it at 27 yrs old with enough money not to have to work for quite a while but not enough to retire--by any means.

Then spent 2 years doing not much more than reading books and drinking heavily at bars, then another 8 after the money ran out trying to stay solvent and out of any sort of "corporate" job. Then a few more after that trying to find a job again. Since the late 1990s it's been rebuilding time, making up for a lost decade.

The fantasy of escape and redemption. If one has the cash or inspiration it can work but I'm building the former and, for the time being, lack the latter. Just a working stiff right now, trying to put a solid foundation under me so I never have to go through the pain and heartache and headache of trying to rebuild from zero. Those years nearly killed me, destroyed my health (used altenative medicine to rebuild a blown-out body), relationships, etc. It's kind of hard to consider that maybe I had to go that for some karmic or soul reason. There's more to it, but this is already more than enough.

Thank you for the good words about getting me adopted by a tribe. That would be kind of neat, I think and I'm sure I'd meet some interesting folks, certainly more interesting than the analysts and bankers I used to work with, although I wasn't very interesting either in those days, and probably still aren't. I've never fit in very well with tribes or groups, always kind of weird and on the outside looking out. You'd never think that looking at me though.

craazyman

12-15-2006, 04:33 AM

no clue about shi. I would guess it trades with the price of oil, but I see that SHI was weak in April-June & oil was going up then. I'd be very scared of putting money in china right now, too much debt in banking system and too reliant on exports to U.S. and too little domestic economic growth. But you know me, I keep waiting for the big crash and it doesn't come. Hell, even Russia was up over 50% this year and I thought they were done last year.

Things are getting funky right now in the sub-prime mortgage market, we're seeing defaults, late payments, etc. The securitization bond holders are getting hammered & this could be the beginning of the great unravelling of the credit bubble with risk aversion spreading like a virus. A little more inflation and it could be curtains. 2007 will be interesting. I'm inclined still to be bearish, but I missed FTEK due to timidity. It's up from 10 to 25.

Isaiah Mpski

12-15-2006, 05:24 AM

I didn't say head to Mexico,just start thinking in that direction.
Money is not a relative thing to most people.
I am,if I can squeeze another 29-30 k out of the stock market by March at the latest am going to buy,in person,a piece of Mexico.
I have made some terrible mistakes in the aforementioned gambling house that could have put me at my set figure before now if I had been more educated in my moves.
I am roughly 20 years older than you and was good enough at what I did to retire at the tender age of 29 or so.
However,my desire to conqueor the world is showing back up and taking me in different ideas that would require a few good disciples,
I talked with the guy at KGBC,ob and he is going to furnish me with the maps of their survey.I would love to take a couple of jeeps,a motorcycle,some gold detectors and hesd through the Sierra Madre Mountains-have you eever seen the movie with Humphrey BOGART-THE TREASURE OF THE SIERRA MADRE,on our way to buy a piece of one of the old vineyards NW of guadalajara.The money is in the bank-40 k-minimum,but we could use some more if if you any friends up there in the BIG APPLE who are wondering how to make the wisest investments now and for the future.Remember I have been exploring Mexico by train,plane,bus,motorcycle,and auto for almost 50 years and wouldn't be surprised if I had great grandchildren there by now,LOL.
I really had some good times in Mexico.
And seriously,some very personal and moments of family etc I cherish.
Another one of dreams-2 really involve the stage coach crossing of the Rio Grande during the Gold Rush Of the 1849.
There are a bunch of burned abandoned structures there and am positive some old coins amid the rubble.The Stage Coach crossed here-just above Taos- and it was an overnight stay with some warm springs nearby.I'm sure after riding anything for several days,the snow covered mountains and the warm springs could,and a little libation,alot of things got lost.It is important to do this in the winter or spring as the river is down because all the rainfall is now turning to snow in the mountains.The Rio Grande level is important because during the summer it dilutes the warm springs.
The canyon itself is very very deep and once they backed the stagecoach down the cutback they had to ferry it across the Rio Grande-and believe me it is a swift cold river to swim across.They had cabins there ,all up above the warm spring bathouse.A great site to take a metal detector if you know where to look.

Another thing I want to do is take pictures of the petroglyphs along the canyon of the Rio Grande-thousands of them there.The early Spainairds carved initials and dates in the volcanic boulders too.Usually higher up than the Indians.Like a cat pissing on his territiory I guess.
Santa Fe is wonderful this time of year but colder than a bitch at night.It's amazing in a way how the same type of people show up there everyyear and it's a bitch to make it throught he winter.Mostly women as I remember-3 to 1 during 1976 when I lived there.

Remember I really became fascinated with Carlos C and also Santana and lived in the company of a brujo for almost a year-on the San Juan Reservation in nOrthern New Mexico.And me-a medical school graduate hematolgist Fellow(UTMB) pediatrician and Ob-gyn Fellow at John Peter Smith Complex-Ft Worth Texas biologist chemist.

My downfall was opiates-on which I had become addicted to in med school,and not by choice.
Caught 10 fish day before yesterday-biggest one was about 15 lbs.
My old black panther is hobbling around.I set up a place for him to stay when it is cold and make sure he is fed.The problem is all the other cats that show up-some of them are really really sick and would take alot of time amd energy to keep them.
Am in a delimnea.
Here it is CM.Williams Brothers.Mediate on it Drew and you Nanouk too.

666maybe

02-01-2007, 12:45 PM

K.J

02-01-2007, 01:02 PM

really like the book 2012, maybe the most inspiring thing I have since reading Jung or listening to Leonard Cohen, or the Nick Cave "Flesh Made Word".

Most things in this forum look too educated for me, I find it very offputting for such an enlightened book to have raw and real feelings armoured in the language of learned and travelled classes. Anything I said here that is real to me would probably be rubbished by learned quotes from ecologists and wisdoms I have never even heard of.

Go ahead and ban me.

Welcome! And please, don't let any of the posts here put you off. We welcome all peaceful views here.

sidecross

02-01-2007, 03:58 PM

really like the book 2012, maybe the most inspiring thing I have since reading Jung or listening to Leonard Cohen, or the Nick Cave "Flesh Made Word".

Most things in this forum look too educated for me, I find it very offputting for such an enlightened book to have raw and real feelings armoured in the language of learned and travelled classes. Anything I said here that is real to me would probably be rubbished by learned quotes from ecologists and wisdoms I have never even heard of.

Go ahead and ban me.

As many on this board already know my formal education stopped ant High School and I made my living from a horse wrangler to a union auto mechanic with many stops in between.

Being stupid is a state of mind; I have met many highly educated people and learned from them that being stupid shows no discrimination.

666maybe

02-01-2007, 05:45 PM

Thanks.

I found lots of things in the book 2012 that resonated with me, such as the idea of angels being part of the world around and within us (imminent?) rather than something so totally above us that we never relate to it, made a nice change from other attitudes around, as I have "seen" various things like angels and demons and other very real spiritual entities, and there is a deadness about nice people who exclude these.

I don't know anything about ecology, and tend to dismiss it as overpaid work for yuppies, don't know if I do or don't agree about climate change or its causes if it exists or if it is irrelevant because something else will get there first; as for peak oil, the economy is based on something not exactly "real", as the author does point out, and inflated currency will make oil look more expensive.

I need to find out more about Quetzacotl, feathered serpent. Does the archeype have anything to do with the tarot major arcana card "The Sun", which comes before "The Last Judgement"? It sounds phoenix like, and the phoenix image has been used in an alternate design for the card "The Sun". "Sunflower weary of time, who countest the steps to the Sun, seeking after that sweet golden clime, where the travellers journey is done, where the youth pined away with desire, and the pale virgin shrouded in snow, arise from their graves and aspire, where my Sunflower wishes to go" (Blake). Look at pictures of the last two major arcana tarot cards in the sequence, the Sun followed by The Last Judgement, then read Blake's poem the Sunflower. Is he describing something coming to an end? What is Time?

666maybe

02-01-2007, 06:02 PM

just thoughts here, and I know I need to do my own research, as before reading this book I wouldn't have considered new age dogmas to have any validity, but the image of the man of gold who is sacrificed, el d'orado? Was that a Mayan myth? That the archetype of the Sun has a dark side? I was wondering how an era described by the tarot major arcana card the Sun could contain some kind of economic crash, as the card seems so positive, but it seems to contain images of myths such as the fall of Atlantis and all that is lost and forgotten, the dark twin on the card? Phaethon, the mortal son of the Sun who crashed the Sun's chariot?

Sorry to go off subject, must find a picture of Quetzacotl.

I always dismissed this stuff as shadowless new age, so don't know much.

daniel

02-01-2007, 06:11 PM

hi 666 maybe,

thanks for your comments - i am flattered to be seen in conjunction with Jung, Leonard Cohen, and Nick Cave - kind of resonates with me in some way.

I am just rereading the Popol Vuh, the Mayan creation myth. It is interesting that the one copy of this book is in Chicago, the center of the US. I was with a friend in Chicago, which seems to be having a major counterculture renaissance, and she noted that it was possible that the Popol Vuh was actually "coming alive again in our time," that the old story is being given a new form, and the old knowledge is reopening across the US. I have been traveling around the US and it does seem to me as if the feathers of the plumed serpent are sprouting up in all sorts of odd locales, from Philadelphia to Salt Lake City to the North West.

As for Quetzalcoatl, I don't know about the Tarot reference. The book on Fulcanelli by Jay Weidner tries to connect Western Alchemy with the Mesoamerican calendar, but I wasn't totally convinced. I think oroborus is one cross-cultural symbol (or the double-headed serpent symbol). Also, Lucifer - I would say that Quetz definitely represents the return of Lucifer (Gnostic "light bringer) in a contemporary form - and as Steiner said, we need a return of Luciferic inspiration to shift the Ahrimanic force of this culture.

Vajra Guru

02-02-2007, 04:15 AM

Daniel,

I would expect nothing more than what Village Voice had to say from them. They are a Murdoch owned media arm and lets be honest he is hardly at the forefront of raising conciousness in the world. Dont expect anything good from his companies...

Bruce

Isaiah Mpski

02-02-2007, 05:14 AM

Daniel,come on man.Get off your high horse.You're not even in the same league with Jung.You're maybe a junior Bertrand Russel but anything more than that is delusional,just like Burning Man and the like.
Just because you're finding disillusionment and depression throughout the western world doesn't make you anything special until you influence it on a higher level than what I've seen so far expressed by you.

K.J

02-02-2007, 01:05 PM

I am just rereading the Popol Vuh, the Mayan creation myth. It is interesting that the one copy of this book is in Chicago, the center of the US. I was with a friend in Chicago, which seems to be having a major counterculture renaissance, and she noted that it was possible that the Popol Vuh was actually "coming alive again in our time," that the old story is being given a new form, and the old knowledge is reopening across the US. I have been traveling around the US and it does seem to me as if the feathers of the plumed serpent are sprouting up in all sorts of odd locales, from Philadelphia to Salt Lake City to the North West.

Which interpretation are you reading Daniel? I recently finished 'Maya Cosmogenesis 2012' by Jenkins and am a fortnight away from finishing 'Mayan Calendar and the Transformation of Consciousness' by Calleman. As a result I've been feeling a pull to read the Popul Vuh sometime soon. The interpretation I'm most interested in is the one by Dennis Tedlock (http://www.amazon.com/Popol-Vuh-Definitive-Mayan-Glories/dp/0684818450/sr=8-1/qid=1170454083/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/102-8674384-5103358?ie=UTF8&s=books).

Salt Lake City sure does seem a strange place to notice the feathers of the plumed serpent sprouting up in, doesn't it? ;)

666maybe

02-02-2007, 04:18 PM

Well I read a lot of stuff recently, searching, and going through hell generally on every level, and a couple of months ago I got to the stage where the only thing that made me feel peaceful was poring over Jung's writings or listening to Leonard Cohen's "Songs from a Room", which I used to as a kid when I couldn't sleep. And Nick Cave's defence of darkness and Duende was more real than all the new age ideas.

Then I went up to Liverpool to see a concert (Echo and the Bunnymen) in mid December, and wandered around looking at the river Mersey, and the wonderful art and history museums and felt more alive, my soul felt waves of something coming back. Maybe it was listening to Ian singing, I love the gothic intertwining of Doors and Joy Division laced with "flowers in their hair".

Anyway, this book is definitely on that same level.

Isaiah Mpski

02-03-2007, 06:58 AM

Dude,here I go again expressing my views to a bunch of Old World neurotics.
We are in a religious war worlds apart from each other.We've come over there twice before and helped you buggers out and If I have anything to say about it,we'll rarely come again,but then again I'm Indian.
Listen,if you can find some common ground with Jung and Daniel,other than a diagnostic way,please ship him and his shit over there and let him start preaching,and sending his followers some money.

666maybe

02-03-2007, 10:18 AM

yeah, the Handsome Family wrote that they are more popular in the UK and Ireland than in their native USA. Something about the self congratulatory have a nice day mentality that excludes the shadow.....and has more prisoners? Hell, I don't really know anything, but you can send the Handsome Family to us any time, your loss. Same goes for Daniel.

Ooooo and I like what Jung says here, "the uncertainty of all moral valuation, the bewildering interplay of good and evil, and the remorseless concatenation of guilt, suffering, and redemption. This path to the primordial religious experience is the right one, but how many can recognize it? It is ambiguous, questionable, dark, presaging danger and hazard; a razor-edged path, to be trodden for Gods's sake only, without assuraunce and without sanction".

I love the without sanction bit.

And yeah, Daniel's book does seem to echo the spirit and often the letter of this stuff.

666maybe

02-03-2007, 10:34 AM

http://www.fabchannel.com/echo_and_the_bunnymen

Try listening to "going up", first track on the set list. If the atmospherics of Echo at the Paradiso, Amsterdam don't suggest "arise from their graves and aspire"?

Jung was writing at an important time in history as the holocaust sacrificed millions to the post war regeneration of the economy. Wasn't that what blood sacrifice was always for? Daniel's book is the only writing I have found to have its finger right on the pulse of what is happening now as we feel the dark side of the Sun. New age shadow denial leaves me cold.

Isaiah Mpski

02-04-2007, 06:42 AM

Jung was writing in a time when he could get all the pure cocaine and opium that his heart desired.
His short time involved with psychedelia and the American Indian helped convince him of,and he preached about the reality of the coming of a physical messiah,who maifests with the ability to phenomenize.He and Freud both did.I think deep down inside Hitler saw himself as the one to lead based on synchronicity and prophesy and metamphetamine psychoses.

I can't quite guage the level of GW's depth of psychoses yet. I see in him more and more periods in which he appears to me to becoming a catatonic schizoid.
Can you imagine.A President taking psychoactive drugs for "depressive" symptoms.
I'm sure they'll just say he had a stroke or a heart attack or something like that and do something with him like his daddy did to William Casey-when was that 86 or so wasn't it.
I don't see anybody in the military who could take control by military force if our armies are wiped out in Iraq etc which could a real possibility.However one big nuclear blast shoulder launched from the wilds of mexico or central Texas or some remote island off of Cuba would change everything.

Let us all pray for peace and more cold weather.

I must concentrate more on becoming more moral and hardworking.

Daniel Tell me about your association with Common Ground and if it's run by the same people who produced a movie of the same name.Tell Mr Hart I said hello.