PDA

View Full Version : dissing the bleep


daniel
03-15-2006, 10:47 AM
The New York Times
Printer Friendly Format Sponsored By

March 14, 2006
Essay
Far Out, Man. But Is It Quantum Physics?
By DENNIS OVERBYE

Can physics save your soul?

Two years ago, a movie with the unpronounceable title "What the #$!%* Do We Know!?" became an underground new-age phenomenon, raking in $11 million out of midnight screenings and word of mouth, spawning an industry of books, tote bags, clothing, DVD's and "biofield" jewelry.

It purported to argue, based on the insights of modern quantum physics, that reality is just a mental construct that we can rearrange and improve, if we are enlightened or determined enough. Science and spirituality have tied the knot, and the world is your infinitely deformable apple.

This winter an expanded version, "What the Bleep, Down the Rabbit Hole," began to play to audiences who say that the movie confirms what they already thought about the cosmos, some vibe they had that it is a slippery, woo-woo-woo kind of place. The movie just finished a two-month run in New York and is to be shown in May at the Quest for Global Healing Conference, in Ubud, Bali, with luminaries like Walter Cronkite and Desmond Tutu attending.

Like its predecessor, this film features a coterie of talking heads: physicists with real Ph.D.'s, biologists, philosophers and a woman who claims to be channeling a 35,000-year-old spirit warrior from Atlantis. It tells the story of a sourpuss photographer played by Marlee Matlin who learns to love herself and take a chance on life.

Like its predecessor, the film touts the alleged power of meditation to affect the crystalline structure of water, as revealed in photographs by Masaru Emoto, a doctor of alternative medicine in Japan. Love and gratitude make for symmetrical and intricate crystals, according to the film, while hatred produces an ugly mess.

If thoughts can do this to water, imagine what they can do to humans, who are, after all, mostly water — at least so runs the mantra repeated several times in the film.

When I first heard that Marlee Matlin had made a movie about quantum theory, I was excited. (Total disclosure: Ms. Matlin once bought an option on the film rights to an essay of mine about Albert Einstein and his wife.) What could be more deserving of wide-screen cinematic treatment than the weirdness and mystery of the laws that sculpture our space-time adventures?

But hours and hours spent watching the two films and navigating their splashy Web site have tempered my enthusiasm. These films and the quantum mysticism industry behind them raise a disturbing question about the muddled intersection between science and culture. Do we have to indulge in bad physics to feel good?

The "rabbit hole" in the title refers to the philosophical muddle that the contemplation of quantum mechanics, the paradoxical laws that govern subatomic life, can lead to. And it is a legitimate and maddening one. Quantum physics proclaims, for example, that an electron (or any object, elementary particle or not) is both a particle and a wave before we look at it, a conundrum neatly illustrated by a cartoon featuring "Dr. Quantum" in the new film.

Physicists have been at war for the last century trying to explain how it is that the fog of quantum possibilities prescribed by mathematical theory can condense into one concrete actuality, what physicists call "collapsing the wavefunction." Half a century ago the physicist and Nobel Prize winner Eugene Wigner ventured that consciousness was the key to this mysterious process.

Wigner thereby, and inadvertently, launched a thousand New Age dreams. Books like "The Tao of Physics" and "The Dancing Wu Li Masters" have sought to connect quantum physics to Eastern mysticism. Deepak Chopra, the physician and author, has founded a career on the idea of "quantum healing," and a school of parapsychology has arisen based on the idea that things like telekinesis and telepathy were a result of probing minds' manipulation of the formless quantum potential. And now the movie.

All of them promote the idea that, at some level, our minds are in control of reality. We are in charge of the holodeck, as one of the characters in "Down the Rabbit Hole" says. And if it doesn't work for you, it's probably because you don't believe.

So what's wrong with that? Like everyone else, I am inspired by stories of personal change. The ideas that consciousness creates reality and that anything is possible make for terrific psychology.

We all know that self-confidence breeds its own success. I wish I were a member of that club. But physics has moved on. It has been decades since anybody took Wigner's idea seriously, said David Albert, a professor of philosophy and physics at Columbia, who has the dubious honor of being one of the talking heads in both "What the Bleep" films and is not pleased with the results.

Many physicists today say the waves that symbolize quantum possibilities are so fragile they collapse with the slightest encounter with their environment. Conscious observers are not needed. As Dr. Albert pointed out, Wigner framed the process in strict mathematical and probabilistic terms. "The desires and intentions of the observer had nothing to do with it," he said.

In other words, reality is out of our control. It's all atoms and the void, as Democritus said so long ago. Indeed, some physicists say the most essential and independent characteristic of reality, whatever that is, is randomness. It's a casino universe.

Not that there is anything wrong with that. There's a great story to be told about atoms and the void: how atoms evolved out of fire and bent space and grew into Homer, Chartres cathedral and "Blonde on Blonde." How those same atoms came to learn that the earth, sun, life, intelligence and the whole universe will eventually die.

I can hardly blame the quantum mystics for avoiding this story, and sticking to the 1960's.

When it comes to physics, people seem to need to kid themselves. There is a presumption, Dr. Albert said, that if you look deeply enough you will find "some reaffirmation of your own centrality to the world, a reaffirmation of your ability to take control of your own destiny." We want to know that God loves us, that we are the pinnacle of evolution.

But one of the most valuable aspects of science, he said, is precisely the way it resists that temptation to find the answer we want. That is the test that quantum mysticism flunks, and on some level we all flunk.

I'd like to believe that like Galileo, I would have the courage to see the world clearly, in all its cruelty and beauty, "without hope or fear," as the Greek writer Nikos Kazantzakis put it. Take free will. Everything I know about physics and neuroscience tells me it's a myth. But I need that illusion to get out of bed in the morning. Of all the durable and necessary creations of atoms, the evolution of the illusion of the self and of free will are perhaps the most miraculous. That belief is necessary to my survival.

But I wouldn't call it good physics.

jtreg
03-15-2006, 11:15 AM
Daniel,

"What The Bleep" has drawn attempted to 'bottle up' and sell an ever-changing and magical process - for myself, it has been a lifetime of exploration and discovery. I yearn for a period of even just a decade ago when it was less fashionable... you could learn and participate in activities that sadly now are so diluted and commonplace that it is no wonder that it attracts so many critics and piss-takers.

I stopped taking drugs about a year ago now and I feel so much better. I have also tried to cut down on going to so many fringe religious meetings... I try to listen to more music... its rearranging my brain patterns in to a happier alignment...

I loved your presentation at the Horse Hospital and look forward to reading your new book...

A final anecdote:
At Rudolf Steiner House recently, they decided at a meeting to use a 'talking stick' because they kept interrupting each other... the stick would be passed from person to person and when the person had the stick, he could talk. Unfortunately, they are such a bunch of twits, they started to chuck the talking stick at each other, and the meeting degenerated into total mayhem.

[ March 15, 2006, 12:16 PM: Message edited by: jtreg ]

Gift Horse
03-15-2006, 05:45 PM
O sweet spontaneous
earth how often have
the
doting

fingers of
prurient philosophers pinched
and
poked

thee
, has the naughty thumb
of science prodded
thy

beauty , how
often have religions taken
thee upon their scraggy knees
squeezing and

buffeting thee that thou mightest conceive
gods
(but
true

to the incomparable
couch of death thy
rhythmic
lover

thou answerest

them only with

spring)


-e.e.cummings

waterthere
03-16-2006, 01:28 AM
It's unfortunate that 'What the Bleep---Down the Rabbit Hole' is out there representing these ideas to the mainstream---some of the 'talking heads' are interesting folks but overall it's just a terrible, terrible film. The computer animated dance sequence set to 'Addicted to Love' has got to be the height of ridiculous/juvenile pap.

Why is it so difficult to participate in these ideas and maintain an amount of integrity?

Gifthorse---thanks very much for that last post. How reassuring, too true.

Respect to all...

Caprinardo Delirio
03-16-2006, 07:28 AM
waterthere, i agree that it's a terrible terrible film. the first one anyway, that's the one i saw; it so annoyed the bug up in my family function. the sheer gravity of the cheesiness of it, just goes to show that physicists are sooo out of touch with reality...

BUT - when i saw bleep, i remembered seeing one of the heads in it, having a discussion with stanislav grof, during the Q&A session of a lecture, i have on video, that grof did in connection with the publishing of 'psychology of the future' in 2000.
the guy's name is stuart hameroff,

and for your enjoyment,

i transcribed it for you:

Grof vs. Hameroff

- brought to you by cap del -

hameroff i'm very interested in the connections between the holotropic states that you describe, and the quantum relativistic physics that you alluded to [woman choughing] .. bohm's a [cough]-folded universe, unfolded part of the universe.. penrose's platonic realm where information, fundamental information, can be transferred to consciousness along the lines of [akkekalise?!?] ring...

grof: you see, i have been very interested in the new paradigme. the book, beyond the brain, that i wrote, the first 90 pages are about the changing paradigme. but i don't think we should take physics as the basis. i was much more interested in the new physics, and so on, to the extend to which it undermines the more traditional monistic materialistic worldview, so that it gives us more freedom to see what we want to see. before, physics was seen, because the universe is only material, physicists were seen as the ultimate authority. as, if you think about it, it's psychiatry and psychology which are the ultimate authorities, because ultimatly everything comes through experience. astronomy is not a science about stars, astronomy is a science about human experiences of what we call stars.

hameroff: matter is the most fundamental thing. matter is a density and curvature of space-time geometry, which is probably the most fundamental thing that [giftwraps?] everything, including mind, i think, but let me make one point, and that is that in the seventies there were a series of studies on psychedelic drugs by saul schneider and jack green and some other people, and they showed that the potency of the psychedelic drugs, in their hallucinogenic, the potency was directly their ability to donate electronic resonance under [geo-wahwah?] receptors, which means, that they would promote a quantum state in the brain. which suggests that the psychedelic states, the holotropic states, may in fact be an increased level of quantum state in the brain, and that consciousness is more or less on the egde between the quantum world and the classical world, and the psychedelic states, the holotropic states are actually a more enhanced state of the quantum state. i can show you those references if you want.

grof: you know, i know you find a lot of evidence in brain physiology and other areas. quantum physics showing correlations of this kind. but the question is the interpretation. if you think about it, we have absolutely no proof that consciousness is created in the brain, that it originates in the brain. all we know is correlations, systematic correlation between events in consciousness and the brain. but they are the same kind of connections that you find in the tv-set. i mean, the quality of the picture and the sound will depend critically on whats happening in the box. but we cannot say that for this reason that the program must be generated in the box. it leaves the possibility that the program is coming from somewhere else, and still things happening in the box, are systematically correlated with it. so i don't know if you can give me one example showing, very clearly, that consciousness must be generated in the brain. beyond the fact that there's correlation...

hameroff: well, i can't prove that anyone's conscious because consciousness is unobservable, and i can't prove that my patients [..] are conscious for the same reason, that i can't prove of consciousness in the first place. so i can't prove that, on the other hand, from what you're saying, that consciousness would equally be in the chair or another object...

grof: that's not what i'm saying, i'm saying that you can [i]experience the consciousness of the chair. now, weather or not the consciousness is out in that chair, is another thing. what you find in a non-ordinary states is that everything that you experience as an obejct in the ordinary state seems to have, in a non-ordinary state, a subjective correlate. i have an experience where, for all practical purposes, i am a secoya tree. here are the [septs?] you know, sort of circulating, here is the foliage, i'm experiencing the photosynthesis.. these are very real experiences, now the question is where are they coming from. i'm describing experiences you know.............. i understand for example, for my experiences, where animistic religion is coming from. now i don't think that it neccesarily means there is a consciousness in every tree. but it means that humans can experience the consciousness of a tree.

hameroff: humans have brains.. i mean animals have brains and i think that animals are conscious.. but, i think the brain does something to access this fundamental information that is present at a very fundamental level. so i think we're not really disagreeing that much, but i'm thinking, what i'm saying is that there's a process that has to occur in the brain, that might occur in different situations, to access and create this experience.

grof: you know, i think there's not a big difference except that we're talking about basic metaphysical assumtions. [about] where you wan't to put emphasis. obviously there is a correlation between matter and consciousness. i would consider consciousness primary, because i know i have consciousness. weather the matter is there, and excatly what it is, is a very complicated question. if we had a fritjof capra here, he would talk you out of this [rumble-rumble] being a microphone. he'd say, well the deeper you go, the less you're finding and when you come all the way down, you end up with equations with probabilities, and there's gonna be someting there that resembles more consciousness; mathematics, order and so on, and there will not be any newtonian stuff left on that level.

hameroff: i don't want to get into this, man, now, i mean we're running out of time, but i think if you're taking that route, i think you're retreating to idealism and solipsism, whereas if you say that matter is not fundamental, and that space-time geometry, quantum gravity, the things that bohm and penrose talked about, are fundamental, and some process at that level leads to consciousness, then i think you can have it both ways....

grof: you see, where i ended up after all these years, is that, i believe that treating the world as if were material is very important. to be able to do that. but i find it difficult to buy it scientifically, or difficult to find it spiritually, because it contradicts many experiences i had. i gave, when we talked before, i gave the example of a quantum phycisist who was working on an accelerator, coming to the conclusion that matter really dosen't exist, you know matter is empty. and then [he] ends the work and goes and crossing the street and a truck is coming, and then he dosen't say, well you know, matter is empty, i'm empty, so.... what's the big deal, and just cross the street. he'll say, well, for this particular situation i will treat a truck and myself as material objects, but whole my research is telling something else, and there's some kind of really strange paradox there. there's a need to hold attension, sort of, between these kind of two complimentary things, in the way you have the wave/particle paradox, and so on. [it's] just another version of that.

-------------------------------------------------

sorry, if the commas are all messed up; danish people absolutely sh*t all over with them...

[ March 16, 2006, 02:21 PM: Message edited by: Caprinardo Delirio ]

postmodernennui
03-16-2006, 10:24 AM
Problematic as the film may be, the NYT article wasn't correct about everything.

From:
http://deanradin.blogspot.com/2006/03/junk-skepticism.html

Junk Skepticism

In a March 14, 2006 essay in the New York Times science section, Dennis Overbye, the Deputy Science Editor at the Times, explains why he thinks the message about quantum observation effects, as portrayed in the movie, What the Bleep do we Know, is wrong. At one point in the essay he bolsters his point with the off-hand statement, "The parapsychologists were booted from the American Association for the Advancement of Science 30 years ago."

Wrong.

In 20 seconds of web searching Overbye could have discovered that the Parapsychological Association (PA) has been an affiliate of the American Association for the Advancement of Science since 1969, and it remains to this day a member society in good standing. I know because I've served as President of the PA for four terms, including this year, and I've been a member of the AAAS for over 20 years. You can verify the PA's status at the AAAS affiliates webpage.

This is an example of what happens when something that "everyone knows to be true" turns out to be false. I call this junk skepticism because it's the worst sort of pseudoskepticism -- mistaken ideas that are easily disproven, but no one bothers to check.

posted by Dean Radin at 10:24 PM

waterthere
03-16-2006, 05:43 PM
Thanks for transcribing that interview, Delirio...

That's fun stuff.

I'd love to hear more about the experiences Grof's alluding to, his 'quantum' experiences.

The bit about experiencing what it is to be a tree reminds me of a moment I've had recently in the nearby woods wherein I knew/knew that the rotting, hurricane damaged trees were dead gods, the husks of dead gods. I felt like I'd stepped into someone else's perception that had collected in that valley in the forest, an older, more primitive perception.

Have you had any good 'quantum' experiences lately?

Anyone?

The world seems overripe with them these days...

Caprinardo Delirio
03-17-2006, 04:05 AM
yesh!

last night, i had a quantum leap to the year 2013, and it was great. all the waiting was over, my sense of time and self had totally shifted, and i was just completely here and now.. well, there and then...

no, i'm kidding.

my friend camilla, on the other hand, will tell you, exactly what it's like to be an old grey, disfavoured police-car!

[ March 17, 2006, 09:00 AM: Message edited by: Caprinardo Delirio ]

waterthere
03-17-2006, 12:53 PM
my friend camilla, on the other hand, will tell you, exactly what it's like to be an old grey, disfavoured police-car! Sure, okay, I wish she would...

or someone would.

All the opinionating around here has it's uses but the most useful things I've found are the shared 'supernatural' experiences.

gandydancer
03-18-2006, 02:10 PM
Personal experiences? Well, I'll have a go at it. I've had enough personal experience of a paranormal nature to convince me that there is a lot we don't yet understand about reality. And to some extent I sorta believe what was in that movie, or at least have my mind open to it. That said, I found myself rolling my eyes A LOT. It's been some time since I saw it and can't give examples, but it seemed to me that they presented their views as though they were accepted scientific fact, and they are not.

Well anyway, I went to the film with a friend who had about the same opinion as I did, but as we drove home we decided we wanted to keep an open mind and try the experiment they suggested: To ask for "a sign", and be very specific about it.

The next day she called me saying that before she took her dog out for their daily walk in the woods she decided she wanted to see an eagle, a bird she feels a relationship with, as a "sign", and has never seen in this area. And, yes, she had just walked up to a high spot on the trail and an eagle flew over her head so close that she felt she could look into its eyes. Actually she felt it did "look" at her. And next she found an eagle feather on the trail.

LOL, we still don't buy everything that film claimed but I'd say she did get her sign.

waterthere
03-18-2006, 02:58 PM
Thanks much, Gandy---

Life is Beautiful, yes?

We need to wear these experiences like armour...