Psychedelic Tourism & Online Stores

[Led_Zeppelin]

I'd like to know a good website where I can buy shamanic plants reliably and cheaply and that has GOOD PRODUCT. I bought salvia tincture from sagewisdom.org and it didn't work. I paid over $100.00 and the seller said, sorry, it doesn't work for everyone. I'm interested in purchasing live plants.

Secondly, can anyone recommend a Mexican or South American shaman or psychedelic tourism for the first timer? I was watching this documentary on cable T.V. where a bunch of foreigners (ie. Americans) followed this shaman to some lake (maybe Peru) and took an unknown sacrament. They mostly had life changing experiences. Anyone know where this is?

Does anyone go to work high on any weed or other shamanic plant? Which ones? Does it help you get through a day of cubical life?

[K.J]

I'd like to know a good website where I can buy shamanic plants reliably and cheaply and that has GOOD PRODUCT. I bought salvia tincture from sagewisdom.org and it didn't work. I paid over $100.00 and the seller said, sorry, it doesn't work for everyone. I'm interested in purchasing live plants.


I'm really surprised to hear this, as I have been a customer of SageWisdom for about 5 years now. I have always received the utmost in quality no matter what I order from them. I just recently ordered a salvia cutting and it's now growing strong. I would suggest that either you used it incorrectly, or you are one of the few that are salvia hard-heads and you may need to up the dose considerably. Also, the lower to mid-range doses of any sublingual preparation of salvia can be subtle. Smoking and sublingual administration are two completely different salvia experiences (similar to smoked DMT vs. orally ingested DMT as in ayahuasca).

[Led_Zeppelin]

I'm really surprised to hear this, as I have been a customer of SageWisdom for about 5 years now. I have always received the utmost in quality no matter what I order from them. I just recently ordered a salvia cutting and it's now growing strong. I would suggest that either you used it incorrectly, or you are one of the few that are salvia hard-heads and you may need to up the dose considerably. Also, the lower to mid-range doses of any sublingual preparation of salvia can be subtle. Smoking and sublingual administration are two completely different salvia experiences (similar to smoked DMT vs. orally ingested DMT as in ayahuasca).

Thanks for your reply, but you did not answer my question. You told me to go back to the same crappy sagewisdom website. I paid over $100.00 for salvia tincture. Me and THREE other people tried this tincture per the instructions. NOTHING HAPPENED WITH ME AND MY THREE FRIENDS. We increased the dose. Still nothing. The guy at SageWisdom offered no refund or exchange. I just got fucked over. For anyone else reading this, look at my first post in the thread and please answer ALL the questions. Please do not pump SageWisdom, because they sage suck.

[Caprinardo Delirio]

are you a heavy weed smoker? i have an idea that strong resistance to TCH will make it harder for you to get off on salvia..

this is just an idea.

anybody?

[magicbean]

one of the commonly known things about salvia is that not everyone gets off on it, and it can take a while. don't blame the seller for your disappointment. do some research, figure it out for your own chemistry.

These plants are areas of research, not blind consumerism where you can complain that you didn't get what you paid for.

[K.J]

Thanks for your reply, but you did not answer my question. You told me to go back to the same crappy sagewisdom website. I paid over $100.00 for salvia tincture. Me and THREE other people tried this tincture per the instructions. NOTHING HAPPENED WITH ME AND MY THREE FRIENDS. We increased the dose. Still nothing. The guy at SageWisdom offered no refund or exchange. I just got fucked over. For anyone else reading this, look at my first post in the thread and please answer ALL the questions. Please do not pump SageWisdom, because they sage suck.

I suppose I was expecting you to read into my reply a little; my mistake. Let me be a bit more obvious about my answer to your question on salvia: there is NO better place to purchase salvia than SageWisdom. I know, I've purchased from many other vendors. There is no vendor out there with his heart into salvia like Daniel is, and no other vendor that sells such consistently high quality material. So, I would suggest either you work with other plant teachers that resonate more with your being, or you be more patient with salvia.

Changing products is simply not going to do the trick when you've already purchased the best out there. Now, it may be that you need more of a kick to the head than the sublingual tincture offers, in that case try the smoking method. I personally prefer oral ingestion.

As for not getting a refund from SageWisdom, below is the screen at which you are required to click the "Yes. I am in agreement with all of the above" button before you're even allowed to shop around the online store. Pay special attention to point #9:


The Sage Wisdom Salvia Shop Gatekeeper

IMPORTANT! Before placing an order, you must verify that you are a responsible adult over 18 years of age and that you understand and agree with all of the following statements. After reading these statements, please click on the appropriate button at the bottom of this page.


I am an adult over 18 years of age. (Warning to minors: false representation of your age constitutes fraud.)

I understand that credit card fraud is a serious crime and therefore will not use another person's credit card unless they have authorized me to do so.

Before completing my order, I will read the ordering instructions and information at the bottom of the Sage Wisdom Salvia Shop page.

I have read The Salvia divinorum FAQ (http://www.sagewisdom.org/faq.html)and the The Salvia divinorum User's Guide (http://www.sagewisdom.org/usersguide.html).

I understand that Salvia divinorum can be quite powerful and must be used responsibly and safely.

I understand that Salvia divinorum can profoundly alter perception and behavior; therefore, I will always work with it in a safe, secure, and private environment.

I understand the importance of having a sober sitter present when exploring the deeper levels of Salvia divinorum's effects.

If I share Salvia divinorum with others, I will first make sure that they are thoroughly informed about the nature of the experience and how to work with it safely.

I understand that individual sensitivity to Salvia divinorum varies quite a lot from person to person; some people are highly sensitive and others are incredibly insensitive.

I understand that when first experimenting with Salvia divinorum, one must start with a low dose; if stronger effects are desired, the dosage can gradually be increased on subsequent occasions until one discovers one's own degree of sensitivity and preferred level of effects.

I take full personal responsibility for my use of any products purchased and will not hold the vendor liable for any mishap that may result from use.

I have made a personal commitment to use this herb in a responsible, intelligent, and safe manner.

[magicbean]

Does anyone go to work high on any weed or other shamanic plant? Which ones? Does it help you get through a day of cubical life?

And while you're getting a spanking, and since you demanded answers to your other questions.

One, for help on the shamanic "tour", try google.

Two, it sounds like you needs a new job, not a rationalization for going to work high.

[Caprinardo Delirio]

going to work high suggests that you've forgotton all about both getting high and going to work..

my friend smoked salvia the day before yesterday.. he just had some extremely funny sensation of a world axis moving through him and the world imposing in on him in a "funny" way.. he was just laughing and finding it interesting like that... no goddess.

[Led_Zeppelin]

And while you're getting a spanking, and since you demanded answers to your other questions.

One, for help on the shamanic "tour", try google.

Two, it sounds like you needs a new job, not a rationalization for going to work high.

My job does not entail heavy equipment or anything dangerous to other people. I've never indulged at work to date. I was asking for an opinion to lower the stress level at a desk job. You sound a little angry in your answer like you work for Partnership for a Drugfree America. I'm already on some anti-anxiety medication from my doctor. I'm not looking for an excuse to screw around and rationalize a high at work. I'm researching to find out if some of these plants are healing in nature. You took my question as.... "Hey folks... I fly an airplane, give me the ok to drop acid, so I can feel better about it." I have a lot of responsibilities and a lot of bills. It's not like I can just walk away from my job. I'm heavily vested in my company. Maybe, you're a hippy and can walk in and out of jobs all the time. I don't have your options. Everyone is not like you. I'm looking for a natural alternative. I'm almost 40 years old and I have very little drug history to date other than pills prescribed by my doctor.

Let me pose a question to you. What kind of occupation do you have? Have you ever smoked weed to keep relaxed and the stress level down? How about a gram or half a gram of shrooms?

[magicbean]

Dude, you're making a lot of wrong assumptions.

Cap said it nicer than me, cause he's nicer than me.

going to work high suggests that you've forgotten all about both getting high and going to work..

It's a stupid idea, since you didn't even do your research into salvia, you probably aren't looking into how pot or any other drugs interact with with anti-anxiety meds, which could cause you a world of grief. I'm sorry your life is so stressful, it's a stressful world, but it's still not a good reason to go to work high for so many reasons, and it's a shame that it seems like the best option to you, and you can't find another way out than one strewn with deep potholes.

But it's not worth it to me to argue with you.

[Dax]

L.Z.-

One of the most important things you need to know about Salvia is that you need to aproach it with respect, and you need to have patience. Many, many people do not exprience a breakthrough their first time working with the plant.

Intent, also, is just as important. What are you hoping to learn from Salvia? What experience are you hoping to gain?

There are a lot of very experienced Salvia-travelers on this board, and most- if not all- would give Sagewisdom their utmost trust and respect. What they told you was true: Salvia doesn't affect everyone the same way. They are not trying to rip you off.

I cannot personally recommend any vendor for purchasing live plants, as I have never purchased one myself. Spirits willing that it does not get scheduled in the next few months, it is something I plan on doing this spring.

Patience, respect, and intent are key. The first you must accept, the second you must find, and the third you must figure out for yourself. This is the best advice I can give.

As for your other questions...

I have no insight on where to go to for a shamanic tour. Sorry...

As for going to work high... well... once again, this is only something you can answer yourself. I have known many people who can handle it just fine, I have known people who only get themselves into trouble. Being high at work might just add to your anxiety, but then again a small toke during your lunch break might help you through the rest of the day. Only you know how the plant affects you.

Believe me, I understand what you are saying. Anxiety sucks... I struggle with it every day. And working a soul-sucking job certainly doesn't help. No it isn't easy to just up and switch jobs, but it is something you might want to keep in mind and work towards. You always have a choice, and rarely (if ever) are the easy choices the ones you want to embark upon.

Hope this helps.... be well.

[ielectric]

going to work high suggests that you've forgotton all about both getting high and going to work...

nicely put cap.

in fact, the question is about work. not about getting high. one would do oneself a service by considering what exactly it means to work.

heavy equipment or not-so-heavy concepts, wrong work will kill you. maybe slowly, maybe not. but it will kill you. as beings whose bodies are - by definition - tools of the spirit, one is best served by a respect for learning. the consequent experience can give insight into the tools one's primary tool [the body] might accessorize in order to facilitate one's purpose [being].

as george clinton twice put it:

you might as well pay attention, cuz the price of free speech is too high to mention

or

you might as well pay attention, cuz you can't afford free speech.

and finally,

"name that feeling."

peace

[sacha]

As far as Salvia, it appears you are not familiar with "breakthrough," and tincture probably is not a good way to achieve breakthrough, it is more effective for those who have already broken through.

For Ayahuasca tours, retreats, etc, you could check this forum:
http://forums.ayahuasca.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=29

Here is a thread on tribe.net (you may have to register):
http://ayahuasca.tribe.net/thread/33b16ede-732c-45f3-97e0-a30b5e827d29

[sidecross]

For what it maybe worth magicbean is only challenging anyone’s comments. It is a style that if taken in a less defensive way helps to sharpen one’s own thinking.

My partner of 42 years, justplaincross, has a similar tone and will argue almost every comment I might make. It is meant to clarify and question. Once you can accept this way of dialogue it will or can sharpen one’s own thinking.

[Led_Zeppelin]

As far as Salvia, it appears you are not familiar with "breakthrough," and tincture probably is not a good way to achieve breakthrough, it is more effective for those who have already broken through.

For Ayahuasca tours, retreats, etc, you could check this forum:
http://forums.ayahuasca.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=29

Here is a thread on tribe.net (you may have to register):
http://ayahuasca.tribe.net/thread/33b16ede-732c-45f3-97e0-a30b5e827d29

Thanks Sacha for the information. It only took 10 posts before someone gave me some quality information. Another dude told me to google the information instead of giving me an opinion on a quality tour. I know how to google thank you. And for all those holy rollers out there who are pissed that I might go to work high... you've convinced me to try it on Monday. You fucked up. I'm going in high as shit Monday just to piss you off. I'll let you know on Tuesday how it went.

[Dax]

LZ-

You asked people for their advice and recommendations. It seems you were looking for specific answers. Not receiving those answers is no reason to be contemptuous.

If you decide to go to work high as shit, it is no one's choice but your own, and you will be the one to suffer the consequences. (Who knows, it may work out perfectly for you!) I highly doubt that you are going to piss anyone here off because of it. What might piss people off is when you lash out as those giving you advice... advice that you asked for.

Please try and be well, LZ. Trust your heart, and it will all work out in the end.

[sacha]

Also, I hadn't read your posts carefully enough to catch the reference to pills prescribed by your doctor, so a warning with regard to Ayahuasca. Many pharmaceuticals, including some OTC ones, can have very dangerous interactions with Ayahuasca. (And South American shamans rarely know about this issue, so they rarely mention it.) You need to carefully do research on MAOI interaction with your specific meds. (Google MAOI + the name of the med.) Anti-depressants can be especially dangerous and with some you need to be off for months to get them out of your system.

There is also an issue with MAOI interactions with some foods, but that is less of a concern. MAOI / food interactions are merely unpleasant, not life-threatening unless you already have a problem with extremely high blood pressure. But MAOI / pharmaceutical interactions can be life-threatening.

As for going to work high (I assume you mean cannabis) -- "I'll just do it to piss you all off" is not an attitude that reflects maturity, but we'll set that aside. How can anyone possibly offer an opinion on that without knowing the kind of work? I know people who do caregiver work at group homes for severely handicapped people who use cannabis to make their work less stressful -- that's one kind of job where it could help. But any kind of job that requires memory and focused concentration, cannabis is not good for. Cannabis can causes forgetfulness, absentmindedness, and careless mistakes that continue for a few days even after the high is gone. When I have smoked cannabis, I have forgotten appointments and tasks even a day or two after. It really depends on how much memory and focused concentration your job requires.

[sidecross]

"...any kind of job that requires memory and focused concentration, cannabis is not good for. Cannabis can causes forgetfulness, absentmindedness, and careless mistakes that continue for a few days even after the high is gone..."


Terence McKenna who admitted to a high use of cannabis often said that he would use it to review transcripts and tapes of his talks to gain a better understanding of what had occurred.

I have been a heavy user of cannabis for many years and I use it for thinking and contemplating. I have personally not been effected by “forgetfulness, absentmindedness, and careless mistakes that continue for a few days even after the high is gone..."

[sacha]

Yeah, it's great for thinking and contemplating, and if you have a job that involves thinking and contemplating (like Terence McKenna) it could be great.

If you have to focus on some boring bureaucratic stuff, maybe not.

[magicbean]

And I'm pretty good at ratcheting up the discussion too.

Zep has clearly demonstrated some things about himself - how well he looks into and examines things, and with what level of maturity he responds to adversity.

What are the chances that he's not going to screw things up going to work high? I'd say near zero, probably starting Monday. Recommending that he "try it" and see what works best for him is hairpatting him.

I'll just do it to piss you all off" is not an attitude that reflects maturity, but we'll set that aside.

No, it's unwise to set that aside. It's critical, and was obvious from his first posts.

Is there a job where forgetfulness, absentmindedness, and careless mistakes don't matter? Maybe abstract painter. Why not go to work drunk instead? Or tweaked? It's all just relative and coolio, right? Whatever gets ya through the day?

sidecross (read this with a grin) wait, but, um how would you know if you have forgotten something???

Terence was reviewing manuscripts on his own time, with his own agenda as the work. Having an employer who sets the agenda is different.

[sidecross]

"...Terence was reviewing manuscripts on his own time, with his own agenda as the work. Having an employer who sets the agenda is different."


This in fact may be good test to see if your current job or task is worthy of your effort.

I would imagine if your work was at the cardboard factory cannabis would be proof enough that your work may be less than fulfilling or even a necessary task in the wider scheme of things.
;)

[Caprinardo Delirio]

how can you be unnecessary in the wider scheme??

cannabis is dangerous at work! :snore:

[sidecross]

how can you be unnecessary in the wider scheme??

cannabis is dangerous at work! :snore:


I wrote working at the cardboard factory is unnecessary in the wider scheme of things; if you feel making cardboard is necessary to a well lived life, we have a difference of opinion.

Many software developers and others in theoretical physics have said their use of psychedelics which would include cannabis has been an asset.

Obviously as someone who rode motorcycles at high speed on winding roads I would not have smoked or ingested cannabis before my ride.;)

[magicbean]

This in fact may be good test to see if your current job or task is worthy of your effort.

Ha! True! But then again I know lots of bright, hard-working people who know themselves, and know they melt like warm jello without some imposed structure, and would spend a lifetime doing nothing they deeply wanted to do without a little outside framework.

And those engineers and physicists...I bet that was home-work, necessary and wonderful homework (oh, how I WISH my college professors had assigned that kind of homework!), but home-work still, not lab-work.

I know people who do caregiver work at group homes for severely handicapped people who use cannabis to make their work less stressful -- that's one kind of job where it could help.

Not picking on your post, sacha, I just happen to do some limited work with disabled adults as well and wanted to provide the opposite viewpoint. They are relying on the caretaker to be the sitter, in effect. The responsible one, the sane one, the caring one, the one who can keep the boundaries and safety lines secure and be totally reliable. I would never disservice them by putting myself in a position where I wasn't fully and totally aware and able to do that. (Dax will be laugh to hear me say this next part.) It's not IMPOSSIBLE that being under the influence of some sort of drug at work is bad. But it's a rare and special case, and I can't really think of what it might be. "Because my job is too stressful" is about the worst reason, maybe right next to "my job is boring". Just ripe with bad fruit, that.

[sidecross]

My point about software and or computer developers and theoretical physicists was the fact, as McKenna pointed out in one of his many lectures that novel discoveries were made under the influence of psychedelics.

I do not mean to imply that they, psychedelics, are a necessity, but for some they are the break thru from circular reasoning and thinking.

[magicbean]

I agree with you.

[ExBrit]

My own experience with salvia: I ordered the enhanced leaves from sage wisdom, and also the cuttings. I didn't have much of an experience with the leaves I bought, but when I grew the plant myself and the plant offered me her leaves (I used those that fell off naturally), the experience was much better and stronger.

The message I took away was "you took the trouble to grow me, so here's my gift" as opposed to just buying it already chopped up and ready to use.

[Led_Zeppelin]

My own experience with salvia: I ordered the enhanced leaves from sage wisdom, and also the cuttings. I didn't have much of an experience with the leaves I bought, but when I grew the plant myself and the plant offered me her leaves (I used those that fell off naturally), the experience was much better and stronger.

The message I took away was "you took the trouble to grow me, so here's my gift" as opposed to just buying it already chopped up and ready to use.

I bought some live plants. They didn't survive too long. It's tropical plant that needs constant humidity I guess.

I went to to work under the influence of two hits. Very calming effect. I was very productive. Got things done w/ out the stress.

[Led_Zeppelin]

Anyone planning a south American Ayahuasca trip to see a shaman? Anyone have an opinion regarding this one:


AYAHUAYRA is a special program to help those in need of healing.
Located in the heart of the Amazon Rainforest, program participants
work closely with a local curandero named Don Juan, towards the
complete and total healing of any and all afflictions. Cancer, AIDS,
Epilepsy, Organ problems, Stomach and Intestinal conditions, STDs,
Depression, Addiction, Mental disorders, Obesity... all can be healed.

AYAHUAYRA is dedicated to learning the wisdom of the ancient cultures.
We are all students and we invite you to learn with us.

http://www.ayahuayra.org/main.htm

[Led_Zeppelin]

The 3rd International Amazonian Shamanism Conference:
Healing Plants and Navigational Tools
Iquitos, Peru, July 7th - 14th, 2007
Chinchilejo e.i.r.l. (Dragonfly in Quechua) is sponsoring the 3rd Amazonian Shamanism Conference in Iquitos, Peru. They are hosts to Soga Del Alma (Vine of the Soul) and invited guest Presenters and healers. The very experienced Presenters and Healers (shamans-curanderos) will be presenting lectures on various Amazonian healing techniques as well as alternative types of natural medicines. These curanderos (male and female) are those that typically use Ayahuasca or San Pedro in order to heal people, reguraly drink these medicinas and carry this knowledge with them in order to help other people make contact with the Vine and cactus and thereby get the knowledge they need to rebalance their beings, their lives and keep on living wisely, with open eyes on the World.

http://www.soga-del-alma.org/ConferenceSite/index.html

Anyone interested in going? Contact me. And please, no Hotos.