The “Unknown” Reality, Volume II, part 1.

[Charlie]

A few days ago, I found a book in my local thrift shop, The “Unknown” Reality, by Jane Roberts. The material is supposedly the results of 65 trance sessions over the course of a year in 1975, from an “energy personality essence” named Seth. The Seth Material is a whole series of books.

Frankly, I always avoided this stuff like the plague. I always felt they were scams, with profound statements from the beyond like “You are a very special person" and “The universe is made of love”.

I opened the book and to my surprise, started reading about subatomic particles, genetics vs. conscious evolution of species and parallels of consciousness with alternate realities.

I read some reviews of the Seth Material on Amazon.com, and looked at a few Seth websites. Most people avoided these particular volumes, saying they were too complicated to read, and did not convey much of a personal message.

Personally, I find this material incredible. It is not difficult to read, but profound in depth and implication. I am currently taking notes as I read, and (if no one has objections) would like to post them here, along with transcibed quotes, as they relate to different topics that regularly appear on this board.

I’ve transcribed a sample below. Basically, it is a rejection of Darwin’s Theory of Natural Selection, and aligns much more with Lovelock and Teilhard’s theories of Gaia and the Noosphere. Italics were literally transcribed as well.

“It has been fashionable in the past to believe that each species was oriented selfishly toward its own survival. Each as seen in competition with all other species. In that framework cooperation was simply a by-product of a primary drive toward survival. One species might use another, for instance. Species were thought to change, and “mutants” form, because of a pervious alteration in the environment, to which any given species had to adjust or disappear. The motivating power was always projected outside.

All of this presented a quite erroneous picture. Physically speaking, earth itself has its own kind of gestalt consciousness. If you must , then think of that earth consciousness as grading upward in great slopes of awareness from relatively “inert” particles of dust and stone through the mineral, vegetable and animal kingdoms. Even then, remember that those kingdoms are not so separate after all. Each one is highly related to each of the others. Nothing happens in one such kingdom that does not affect the others. A great, gracious cooperation exists between those seemingly separate systems, however. If you will remember that even atoms and molecules have consciousness, then it will be easier for you to understand that there is indeed a certain kind of awareness that unites these kingdoms.

In your terms, consciousness of self did not develop because of any exterior circumstances in which your species won out , so to speak. In fact, the consciousness of self in any person is dependent upon the constant, miraculous cooperations that exist between the mineral, vegetable and animal worlds. The inner intent always forms any exterior alteration. This applies on any scale you use. Consciousness forms the environment. The environment itself is conscious. Atoms and molecules themselves operate in their own fields of probabilities. In their own ways, they “yearn” toward all probable developments. When they form living creatures they become a physical basis for species alteration. The body’s adaptability is not simply an adjusting mechanism or quality. The cells have inner capabilities that you have not discovered. They contain within themselves memory of all the “previous” forms they have been a part of.”

Comments?

[ June 25, 2004, 11:29 PM: Message edited by: Charlie ]

[dragonfly]

Thanks for sharing this. I've never read the Seth stuff either, but what you posted fits with my own intuitions about molecular consciousness developed through hallucinogen use.

[willoweyes]

I don't care if this stuff comes from the mysterious Seth, or straight from the mouth of some no-cred housewife in Kansas. Stimulating ideas are fun; no matter if the source is tarted up.

[jezebelle]

Charlie fantastic I am a big fan of the Seth material. I read just about everything. It was my first emergence into that kind of infomation. I don't like that sort of stuff (and there is still alot of junk) but like you, I found myself reading it and it hit home on alot of issues.
It just made sense, like admitting that you loved John Denver (the singer) but not wanting to tell anyone that you did.
I will go so far as to admit that my perceptions changed by reading it, and the dreams after a night session were phenomenal.
You go dude!
I am more open because of it.

[Dancinginbigapple]

Someone else has discovered Seth! My discovery was about 27 years ago now, in the supermarket. I was looking through the books and found "The Nature of Personal Reality". After reading the first paragraph it felt authentic and real in a way no other book on metaphysical matters ever had. I of course, over the years, have read every book Jane and Rob published, including the one covering her year in the hospital before her death. My three sons were raised on Seth ideas so of course they see the world in a different way that I cannot experience because I still function on some of the beliefs that I was surrounded by for many years. But, I basically "know", after years of immersing myself in Seth, that I am constanting creating my own experience. Can't talk to others about it much because they always think you are saying that "bad" experiences are their "fault". I always suggest people read "Nature" first because it's the most appealing in that it the practical application of his ideas. Seth wrote The Unknown Reality for those who were curious to know more about what was behind the curtain. Maybe I'll be inspired now to go back and reread some of my Seth books, which I can see in the bookcase a few feet away from where I'm sitting now. My younger son reads Seth before going to bed, and I, the one who used to be able to quote, almost by book and page, is the one who has forgotten. I have found the latest books, The Early Sessions, to be fascinating. They cover the years before the first published book.

[Gift Horse]

I've read Seth too.

I started reading "Seth Speaks" as a teenager. I found it very arduous but I read it thinking that part of me will take it in and change my reality eventually.

I found the novels, "The Education of Oversoul 7" to be much more accessible. Very simplified information....but hey, thats where I was at.

I remember giving the book to my Dad for his birthday. Later he said he couldn't read it because it was so poorly written. I said that I didn't give it to him for its literary merit! Oh well.

[toppersbazaar]

Charlie, funny i just posted some thoughts about Seth I devoured his material during my peak years of exploration....you should real my "worldview-nature of reality and let me know what you think
Toppersbazaar.com see ya

[toppersbazaar]

To this day and I'm 39 I have never read anything as profound as Seth...each word in each book hit me like a Mack truck filled with truth....read it high...it's like everything is talking to you...I really suggest everyone read this material.....i think the first book is called Nature of Reality and then Nature of personality..it's totaly scientific

[Proteus]

My wife has just finished reading the Unknown Reality for the (at least) 3rd time. Like others here, i've come to a grudging respect for the "material"--after writing it off at first as so much new-age crapola. But, my wife, has good-naturedly been reading me extracts from various of his books for several years now &, other than his (apparently) uninformed dogmatism about not using psychedelics, everything i hear resonates with everything that i'm coming to know about whatever THIS is.

These days, i find myself thinking of Jane's experience of Seth and her many interesting "visions." The way she writes about them reminds me of any number of trip reports on this & other sites. Also reminds me of the contemporary reports of William Blake's and St. Theresa's visions: they came whether or not they were wanted and they often appeared mingling with so-called "external" reality.

Don't know where i'm going with this; guess i just wanted to affirm that the Seth Materials are well worth the trouble of finding (some are now out of print) and reading.

[indigomonkey]

I've read all the Seth books, as well as Jane's books, including the early sessions and now the first 4 volumes of the private "deleted" sessions. If you are enamored by Seth's ideas and you've read Nature of Personal Reality, I suggest next reading The Individual and the Nature of Mass Events. "Unknown" is excellent and I'm re-reading it now, but in this time of amazing crisis in our country with the white house being taken over by imbiciles, it behooves the even slightly initiated Seth reader to read Mass Events. It takes the idea of creating our personal reality further into how as a society we create, say, our country. It helps a person feel (don't throw any new age books at me for this) empowered. At the time it was written the vietnam war was raging and basically everything he wrote then applies now quite spefically!!!

Seth harps on dreams and dream art science in "Unknown" and if you are interested, Edgar Cayce was a huge propenent of training people to explore and use their dreams for personal and social betterment. I have to sign off but I'll be back.

-Tina

[Charlie]

Proteus wrote:

other than his (apparently) uninformed dogmatism about not using psychedelics, everything i hear resonates with everything that i'm coming to know about whatever THIS is.

I am on my fourth Seth/Jane Roberts book, The Nature of Personality Reality, and have finally come across the topic of psychedelics.

There is an entire chapter devoted to the topic of LSD; more specifically, against the use of massive doses of LSD for psychological therapy (apparently this was an still an option available to therapists in 1974). Seth at every turn emphasizes the word “massive doses”.

A random quote:

In times of seemingly calamitous encounters with nature, individuals may find themselves amazed at their capacity to relate with other people, but in the artificially induced psychic disaster area of massive LSD therapy, the situation is reversed. Consciousness finds itself in a crisis situation; not [because of one coming] from the exterior world, but because it is forced to fight on a battleground for which it was never designed and cannot understand, where basically counted-upon allies of association, memory and organization, and all the powers of the inner self, are suddenly turned into enemies. It is made vulnerable to all those forces it was meant to lead, while being stripped of its natural logical abilities—indeed, of its very sense of identity. There is nothing exterior against which it can work, and no framework in which it can get balance.

However, a clear distinction is made in the chapter:

“I am not speaking of marijuana at all, which is a different thing altogether and is a natural product of the earth. I am talking about a chemical that is a result of your technological knowledge.”

And later:

“Assaults upon your consciousness in such a manner challenge the stability of your species, and insult the integrity of your creaturehood. You may say that such chemicals are natural because they exist within the reality you know, but the body is equipped to deal with ingredients that come from the earth. Great doses of “artificial” drugs are not easily assimilated, and bring about biological confusion.

Within their native framework, some American Indians use peyote their own way—but not as gluttons, stunning and annihilating their systems. They accept it as a natural ingredient belonging to their earthly structure. They do not try to blast themselves out of existence. They use it to increase the innate perceptions that they have.

They become a part of All That Is—as they should—without dying as they are. They are able to assimilate their knowledge, to purposefully direct it into both their individual lives and their social structure. They also use it within their own system of beliefs, of course, in which their creaturehood is understood and taken for granted. The conscious mind is seen as a complement, rather than a detriment, to biological being.”

[daniel]

Interesting comments from Seth... gotta read that stuff some day.

I would say that LSD remains as a massive question mark: Its particular emergence out of the center of Nazi Europe in 1943, while the Final Solution raged, discovered by a chemist in Basel, Medieval center of alchemy, who had repeated dreams about its chemical structure and had never recreated a failed compound before... this is clearly the stuff of some kind of crucial still-unfolding myth. The question of whether to call LSD "natural" or "technological" in origin seems kind of moot to me - clearly it is a substance that has a particular destiny with our modern Western consciousness. I would suggest that its true uses and its ultimate purpose have yet to be uncovered. It seems to be something we will come to in stages of realization.

I would say that it is a fantasy of mine to help, eventually, in some differently constructed world, to find the proper context and use of this particular ally... I think the fact that it has no body load is significant, and would suggest that sexual alchemy may be part of the puzzle.

Hmmm... I was looking at some of the Nag Hammadi material and it seemed there was some mentions of a "Seth" as a teacher of humanity (something like that), was wondering if there was some connection. What does Seth say about his origin and purpose?

[Buzz]

Maybe it was Terence McKenna who gave LSD to an Amazonia shamen. I forget, perhaps it was someone else. But, the shaman replied that it "was good, it could be used for healing." Robert Gordon Wasson gave the Mixtec shaman Maria Sabina a dose of synthetic mescaline (or synthetic mushrooms, memory not serving me too well). She said it was good, that it had a spirit and could be used for healing.

Though mediums do channel various personalities and supposedly cannot remember what happened, I do believe that the prejudices of the individual mediums sugar coats the message. Maybe not in all cases.

I'm not sure what Seth means by a massive dose, but only once I got ahold of a large quantity, or some very strong LSD. I could not speak. I was kind of immobile as well, though fairly aware of everything in the environment. I spent the night cruising the backwoods of Louisiana in the backseat of a Volkswagon. My three friends were partying, making noise. I could not interact. They were actually driving me nuts, but I couldn't move to get out or talk to tell them I wanted out. That's about the worst situation I ever had with LSD.

[Isaiah Mpski]

The soul contains within itself the memories of our previous experiences that we have been a part of that is passed on to us by intuition.

Charlie I do not understand your malicious slander of me.Is it because of my French roots,or my Bosgue(sic) leanings.

My earthly father abandoned me a long time ago.I don't feel accountable for their bad karma.

[Charlie]

Buzz: The question of dosage piqued my interest as well, but nowhere in the chapter was a “massive” dose actually defined. I find it interesting that Maria Sabina would tag a man-made chemical like LSD with it’s own spirit, but then again, we could argue that life exists in all things…

Daniel: Jane Roberts husband, Robert Butts addresses the subject of Seth’s actual name: Seth was an Egyptian God, the third son of Adam and Eve—there was a Gnostic sect called the Sethites—plus the name shows up in the cabala, etc. Seth himself, however, simply said he called himself that because Jane seemed to need a name to hang on him, and for no other reasons. He does state that he’s had numerous physical carnations on earth, mostly trivial and unimportant, from a historical sense. He states his purpose in speaking through Jane Roberts as addressing the need for mankind to awaken to the true nature of reality.

If you ever do get around to reading any of these, I would suggest both volumes of The Unknown Reality. It is a brilliant treatise on quantum physics and subatomic particle movement, with an entirely logical (to my mind) extension into frequencial consciousness and time. It also treats the topic of the soul and reincarnation in a fascinating manner; although I’m not sure I concur (who really knows for sure?), it certainly made for interesting conjecture.

Seth Speaks was more titillating than anything else, touching on many interesting topics but rarely developing them…some of the theories, especially regarding the historical life of Jesus, were hard for me to swallow.

I am halfway through her seminal bestseller, The Nature of Personal Reality, and have not been particularly impressed. It is a self-help book about personal empowerment, not much more.

All of the books have been valuable for me in that they uniformly stress the importance of dreamwork; I have seen a real improvement in my dream retention and interpretative understanding, as a result of this material.

I still feel a little weird posting about these books—I guess I’m afraid of being classified as some kind of foggy-minded Seth groupie.

As far as LSD…Why do you sugget a sexual element? I’ve dropped acid a few times, and didn’t find it particularly stimulating, sex-wise. That seems more to be a property of MDMA—they don’t call it Ecstasy for nothing.

[Isaiah Mpski]

Your comment about the Indians and peyote is right on.It is regarded as medicine rather than a way to get high.I have never been through a peyote ceremony and not come out not wanting to to be more morally and physically healthy.
I really need some now.

[zenafire]

I am of the nature loving kind and think that elements of the earth are much kinder on our species, yet there is a reason LSD was discovered. Keep in mind that gluttony/lack of balance in the consumption of any substance is unwise.

I agree that sexual alchemy and LSD go hand in hand and that we are not yet utilizing our tech knowledge to its fullest. I have had some of the most intense psychic experiences when combining LSD, sex and love (love may be key, too). I have experienced past life “stuff” and afterward had my then husband tell me he was “there” with me and described details matching my own inner experience. Ecstasy has the bodily effect of stimulation and the emotional effect of openness and kindness, but what I have experienced in sex and LSD went to the cellular level and to my soul.

Humans strive for the transpersonal experiences (sex is certainly such). It is, I believe, part of the evolution of our consciousness to move beyond the body with it as a vehicle to reach expanses of reality we have glimpses of through these experiences, our “biological being” expanding our “conscious mind."

[nanouk]

Humans strive for the transpersonal experiences (sex is certainly such). It is, I believe, part of the evolution of our consciousness to move beyond the body with it as a vehicle to reach expanses of reality we have glimpses of through these experiences, our “biological being” expanding our “conscious mind."

alchemy, you've got it, xenafire. it is all about balance of the elements within as well as outside...

love and respect,
~N.

[Isaiah Mpski]

LSD was not discovered.It was here probably long before humans.There is just an outbreak of it ever once in a while.A fungal infection of sorts.

Results this lifetime in torts.Don't ever give LSD without a guarantee.

Dr John D. Son MD,ND,MND,psychiatry

[Isaiah Mpski]

Zena,
You turn me on.
Mpski

[zenafire]

Mpski-My post was meant to be stimulating, but not in the way you are referring.

Fungal as in ergot? hmmm first time I've come across any mention of LSD being naturally occuring w/o human intervention.

[nanouk]

you've never heard of ergot(as a natural form of LSD)?!

thousands of ppl were burned at the stake because of it...

[ January 07, 2005, 09:35 AM: Message edited by: Nanouk ]

[daniel]

i don't think the compound in ergot is LSD - LSD was the 25th in a series synthesizing variations on LSA, the naturally occurring compound in LSD. I am not sure that LSD in its pure form has been found in nature - but it may be that it has. If anyone has real factual knowledge on this, please let me know.

Isiah -
not to be schoolmarmish, but please try not to post responses that are going to make people reluctant to post candidly about their own experiences in the future, sexually or otherwise. So much of the web is devoted to cheap turn-ons, perhaps we can keep that tone out of this one.

[Buzz]

And don't stick any needles in your arms. Unless its insulin and your diabetic.

[Buzz]

Charlie, if it makes you feel any better, I'm a real Edgar Cayce nut. But like your feelings about Seth and religious material, Cayce's Christian religious stuff seems to be coming from a belief of the medium themselves. But there is more to it than what any modern Christian would dare to conjecture. Certainly curious points of interest out there in oije board land.

[Isaiah Mpski]

Sorry master.

Mpski-2005

[Isaiah Mpski]

Buzz,you forget I am an alternative practioner and chelation specialist.I start IV's on people and with a mixture of vitamins,minerals,amino acid remove toxic heavy metals and all sorts of other crud.I can give 50 times as much Vit C IV as you should take by mouth.Thats good for all sorts of diseases including diabetes,cancer and dementia.
And I do it for almost free.

Dr John

[ January 07, 2005, 03:34 PM: Message edited by: Isaiah Mpski ]

[nanouk]

"Ergot is an old member of the materia medica. It has been used in traditional medicine and it has been scientifically studied for more than 50 years. Among those studying ergot and its derivatives was the Swiss chemist Albert Hofman whose experiments let to the discovery of LSD, an ergot derivative that strongly interferes with the neurotransmitter serotonin. "

Catcher in the Rye (http://www.ergot.org/)

there is a Library of information on ergot...
:D

[ January 07, 2005, 06:53 PM: Message edited by: Nanouk ]

[nanouk]

Grasses were even more sacred than the Oak to the Druids, i wonder Y? *lol*
tongue.gif

[daniel]

nanoul

why don't you do some research, come back and tell us - otherwise please don't waste my mindspace with this drivel.

[Isaiah Mpski]

Kind Master
Nanouk has been doing alot of research with me lately.
Please forgive her and her schoolgirl giddiness.

A Laird

[ January 08, 2005, 12:08 PM: Message edited by: Isaiah Mpski ]

[Ull]

MARIA SABINA DID SYNTHETIC PSILOCYBIN
(not LSD or synthetic Mescaline)
- with R. Gordon Wasson & Albert Hofmann, who was the man to isolate & synthesize psilocybin from the mexican magic mushrooms brought to Europe by Wasson. Maria Sabina, "curandera" trained in psilocybe-use, confirmed (Oct. 1962) that the synthetic compund contains the "spirit" of the mushroom, and that she could use them interchangably.

"After about another quarter of an hour, the spirit of the pills did begin to yield its effect, which lasted until the crack of dawn." ... "...the curandera said that the pills had the same power as the mushrooms, that there was no difference. This was a confirmation from the most competent authority that the synthetic psilocybin is identical with the natural product. As a parting gift I let Maria Sabina have a vial of psilocybin pills. She radiantly explained to our interpreter Herlinda that she could now give consultations even in the season when no mushrooms grow."

- p. 123, "Ride through the Sierra Mazateca in Search of the Magic Plant 'Ska Maria Pastora'" - Albert Hofmann, in "The sacred Mushroom Seeker", Ed. Th. J. Riedlinger, Park Street Press, 1997.

Hope that clears it up.

[nanouk]

i believe that the power is within the spirit of the shaman/ess, if the guide can handle the experience, then she or he will be apt to judge whether the seeker can digest the medicine in particular...

it is like any medicine of the earth, one will absorb the lesson if able to do so, at that time in space...

[Gnosisolarium]

just starting unknown reality vol 1.. soo far soo good :D

[felix4life]

those who love Seth books, also check out Abraham-hicks books, very easy to understand.

Abraham & Seth; an energy soup?
Recorded 03/16/02 in San Francisco, CA (09:47 minutes)
Description: Abraham, you are an entity, and it’s a combination of many who come together, is my understanding. I have a sense that Abraham is not just this entity, and then there’s a Seth entity, and then there’s a Solomon entity. It’s all one quantum soup kind of Energy?
Quotation: "YOU CAN TRUST that what you are receiving is accurate,... that it is being projected to you...that it is understanding your question...that it is an adoring loving Energy...that it hears everything that you are wanting to know. And YOU CAN TRUST that you know what it says--when you are in vibrational harmony with that which it is."

http://www.abraham-hicks.com/

also here is a seth newsgroup that I am a part of: http://www.cafemuse.com/sethnet/

[ June 19, 2005, 07:35 PM: Message edited by: felix4life ]

[Gnosisolarium]

excellent links.. muchos gracias